Jet Li's Fearless: R1US/R2UK/R4 cut vs R3HK cut (SPOILERS)

tom2681 · Post by **tom2681** » 05 Jan 2007, 00:49

This thread is about the differences between the original chinese theatrical cut and the R1 so-called "unrated cut".

EDIT: EvaUnit02 has confirmed that the R2UK and the R4 feature the R1US unrated cut as well.

The R3 starts with a CGI-enhanced wushu demo by Jet.
This scene DOES NOT EXIST on the R1 (actually it's still there, but in the middle of the film). It's replaced by white text on a black screen.

8 minutes in, just before the title card, the R3 shows a very worried japanese fighter about to face Jet(forgotten his name).
On the R1, they replaced the shot with another where he's very determined and angry.

The R3 cuts directly from Young Yuan-Jia's defeat to him studying.
Ironically, the R1 has an added scene where his father scolds him.

The scene where Yuan Jia's daughter is waiting for him on the stairs remains unchanged, but a close-up of his mother and servant is missing on the R1 (go figure).

When Yuan-Jia almost drowns in mid-film, he has a near-death experience. He sees his daughter and his mother underwater.
None of that exists in the R1.

When Yueci speaks to Yuan Jia for the first time, she's telling her story in close-ups on the R3 (so you can't guess who she is, or where they are).
On the R1, it's all wide shots.

R3:

R1:

On the R1 you can still hear Yueci playing the flute, but she doesn't get her close-up.
Too bad, that was one of my favourite shots from the R3.

R3:

Heyyyy, I found the missing Wushu scene.

The R3 goes directly from a pensive Jet to a conversation with Yueci.
The R1 puts the wushu demo between the 2 scenes (interesting choice).

R1:

R3:

When Jet returns to civilization, the editing gets a bit weird.
R3: Visits his father's grave, meets the master's wife, asks his friend for help.
R1: Visits his father's grave, bumps into his old students (added scene / see below), asks his friend for help, meets the master's wife.

Although the final fight is intact, the ending has been shortened by 4 or 5 shots.
Yueci's arrival in Jet's "dream" is shortened, and Jet's nocturnal wushu practice is trimmed.

R3 Only:

R3 Only:

R1 and R3:

My comparison is over.
I hope you liked it (Although I'd prefer if you hated it

).

There are lots of other scenes that were trimmed a bit but I don't have the patience to list them all.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 05 Jan 2007, 01:14

Grrr we know have FOUR cuts and none of them actually UNCUT :shock:

The fourth being the Thai Cut, currently the longest/best cut, pity the Thai DVD doesn't have English subs.

They really like to fuck around with Asian films in America. They create an alternate cut then cut it back even further for it's PG-13 Theatrical run. I'm pleased I didn't pick up the HD-DVD Combo now I don't want no inferior cut.

So in your opinion Tom despite the USA Unrated Cut getting additional scenes the HK cut is the better one? It sounds like the USA cut got snippets more but minutes removed.

Is that correct?

I have that 1.81: DVD-Rip too, it's good quality. Along with the proper subs on the UK R2/R4 I'll opt for that one to get it 2.35:1. I need to watch any version first

p.s - As you say we just need to know if the UK/Australia got the HK Cut or USA Unrated Cut. I'm suspecting HK Cut.

tom2681 · Post by **tom2681** » 05 Jan 2007, 01:22

Bradavon wrote:in your opinion Tom despite the USA Unrated Cut getting additional scenes the HK cut is the better one?

Yes, because the added R1 scenes don't add much to the film.
It's still a badly trimmed version of the original.

Lots of beautiful shots are missing (Yueci playing the flute, Yuan-Jia's near-death hallucinations).

If you take into account the 90 second difference in the duration AND the 2 added R1 scenes, I'd say about 5 minutes are missing. That's a lot IMHO.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 05 Jan 2007, 01:32

WOW 5 Minutes thanks.

How long do the R1 scenes add up to 90 seconds plus???

tom2681 · Post by **tom2681** » 05 Jan 2007, 01:39

Wait a sec, lemme do the math here...

HK cut = 105,15 minutes.
US cut = 103,33 minutes.
Added R1 scenes = roughly 2 minutes.

Missing Time = around 4 minutes (give or take 20 seconds).

And it's weird because there are no missing scenes per se on the R1.
They've just trimmed every single scene by a few seconds.

EvaUnit02 · Post by **EvaUnit02** » 05 Jan 2007, 02:37

bradavon wrote:p.s - As you say we just need to know if the UK/Australia got the HK Cut or USA Unrated Cut. I'm suspecting HK Cut.

Yup, I can confirm that R2/R4 disc has the USA Unrated cut.

thelostdragon · Post by **thelostdragon** » 05 Jan 2007, 03:23

Whoa! The unrated cut makes "Fearless" a completely different movie. It kinda changes what Jet Li wanted to express with this film. Not showing him being defeated, although he was just a kid or showing the Japanese guy as a villain actually give you the cliché "I must fight him" impression of a movie.

Tom, which cut is the one we both have from DVD *****? Isn't it the R3 cut?

The only further version I will ever buy of this film is the extended, English (German?) subtitled cut. Maybe on HD/Blue Ray if the extended one is being released on that.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 05 Jan 2007, 03:23

tom2681 wrote:HK cut = 105,15 minutes.
US cut = 103,33 minutes.
Added R1 scenes = roughly 2 minutes.

What do you mean by US cut? Do you mean the Theatrical Cut? and the R1 scenes are the Unrated Cut?

I'm confused because US + R1 would make it longer???

tom2681 · Post by **tom2681** » 05 Jan 2007, 03:46

LD wrote:which cut is the one we both have from DVD ******? Isn't it the R3 cut?

Yes it is. And I'm keeping mine.

Brad wrote:What do you mean by US cut? Do you mean the Theatrical Cut? and the R1 scenes are the Unrated Cut?
I'm confused because US + R1 would make it longer???

Let's clarify it:

Full US Unrated Cut (including the 2 added scenes) = 103,33.
US Unrated Cut minus the 2 added scenes = ~101,33.
HK cut = 105,15 minutes.

slasher13 · Post by **slasher13** » 05 Jan 2007, 09:19

Oh dear, I have the mainland version on Divx, was going to deleted it when my UK dvd arrives, but now think will keep it. Reading from what Tom has written, the mainland version is alot better, I love the beginning, when Jet Li is performing his wushu with the beautiful music in the background..

Shame the west didnt get the HK cut

thelostdragon · Post by **thelostdragon** » 05 Jan 2007, 13:33

slasher13 wrote:I love the beginning, when Jet Li is performing his wushu with the beautiful music in the background..

I love that scene as well, especially SPOILER

at the end of the film. It kinda brought tears to my eyes, because it is so beautiful to look at and in my opinion is the perfect closing to the film.

SPOILER

slasher13 · Post by **slasher13** » 05 Jan 2007, 14:50

thelostdragon wrote:
slasher13 wrote:I love the beginning, when Jet Li is performing his wushu with the beautiful music in the background..
I love that scene as well, especially SPOILER

at the end of the film. It kinda brought tears to my eyes, because it is so beautiful to look at and in my opinion is the perfect closing to the film.

SPOILER

Indeed, I can't believe that the UK dvd doesn't show this. Damn.. Now Im going to convert my divx to dvdr for this with fansub

tom2681 · Post by **tom2681** » 05 Jan 2007, 15:15

Slasher13 wrote:Indeed, I can't believe that the UK dvd doesn't show this.

Wait... aren't you guys misinterpreting my post ?
The first Wushu scene is still there, except that they've put it in the middle of the film instead of the beginning (see middle of first post).

The last Wushu scene is still there too, but it's trimmed a bit (4 or 5 shots).

Technically, no full scenes have been removed.

slasher13 · Post by **slasher13** » 05 Jan 2007, 15:49

tom2681 wrote:
Slasher13 wrote:Indeed, I can't believe that the UK dvd doesn't show this.
Wait... aren't you guys misinterpreting my post ?
The first Wushu scene is still there, except that they've put it in the middle of the film instead of the beginning (see middle of first post).

The last Wushu scene is still there too, but it's trimmed a bit (4 or 5 shots).

Technically, no full scenes have been removed.

Yes I am misinterpreting your post

Okay do you also have the black and white stock footage in the beginning with the chinese writing saying about the history, or is it simply a black screen which dissolves to Jet Li doing wushu?

tom2681 · Post by **tom2681** » 05 Jan 2007, 16:17

Pictures can tell a thousand words.

R3:

R1:

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 05 Jan 2007, 19:05

Tom, how can you call young Yuanjia being reprimanded by his father for fighting and the elder Yuanjia meeting his 'lost' students after time away irrelevant, yet lament the loss of a close-up of a girl playing her flute? From what you describe it seems like the International Cut is an improved upon version, re-edited by Yu. Remember the HK cut was put together rather hastily in comparison.

tom2681 · Post by **tom2681** » 05 Jan 2007, 19:13

Mark wrote:Tom, how can you call young Yuanjia being reprimanded by his father for fighting and the elder Yuanjia meeting his 'lost' students after time away irrelevant, yet lament the loss of a close-up of a girl playing her flute?

That's because the HK cut is my reference.

As far as I'm concerned, these 2 added scenes are not meant to be in the film at all (because they were added after the film was released).

Sure, the R1 Unrated Cut looks like a refined version of the film.
But they've cut so much stuff... I wouldn't call it an improvement.

Hopefully the DC will soon be released (and I hope it will be a longer HK cut instead of a longer R1 cut) and this thread will become irrelevant.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 05 Jan 2007, 19:22

That opening sequence looks much better on the R3.

tom2681 wrote:Full US Unrated Cut (including the 2 added scenes) = 103,33.

Which is the UK Cut, right? Call it the Western Cut please it's far less confusing.

tom2681 wrote:US Unrated Cut minus the 2 added scenes = ~101,33.

Which is the USA Theatrical Cut, right?

Tom, which cut is the one we both have from DVD *****? Isn't it the R3 cut?

Is this the HK DVD with English subs or the 1.85:1 version?

tom2681 · Post by **tom2681** » 05 Jan 2007, 19:29

OK. Fine. Western cut it is.

-US Unrated Cut minus the 2 added scenes = ~101,33.
-Which is the USA Theatrical Cut, right?

No.

USA Theatrical Cut = Western Cut minus the violent shots.

-which cut is the one we both have from DVD *****?
-Is this the HK DVD with English subs or the 1.85:1 version?

AFAIK it's an Edko bootleg with english fansubs.
Forget about the 1:85 transfer. It looks like the DVD that has it doesn't exist.

Note: I've edited a few posts. I don't think we should mention the name of a website that only sells bootlegs.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 05 Jan 2007, 19:54

I was thinking that site was a bootleg site so yes as Tom says no talking of how/where to source bootlegs please.

Well I'm completely confused. This is right? -

* USA Theatrical Cut - The Western Cut, cut down to a PG-13 and on the R1 DVD
* Western Cut - The cut used on the R1 DVD too, named the Unrated cut on the R1 DVD and also used on the UK R2/R4. Both virtually the same.
* HK Cut - As featured on the HK Edko DVD and in HK Cinemas
* Thai Cut (the longest cut) - The HK Cut (has this been confirmed?) + the Thai fight deleted scene from the R1

Is that correct?

EvaUnit02 · Post by **EvaUnit02** » 06 Jan 2007, 01:21

bradavon wrote:Is that correct?

You answered your own question.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 06 Jan 2007, 02:12

I'll take that as a yes

. Tom managed to confuse me with all his names for each cut.

thelostdragon · Post by **thelostdragon** » 06 Jan 2007, 02:18

bradavon wrote:Tom managed to confuse me with all his names for each cut.

With Bullets recently becoming more and more famous, he's only trying to get the attention of big studios in order to be hired as name finder for the various cuts and DVD editions.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 06 Jan 2007, 02:29

Yep a prolific spammer and a webmaster who thinks the answer to user feedback is to ban them. Just the sort of people we need

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 06 Jan 2007, 03:59

Tom, how can you say those two scenes aren't supposed to be there when that international version was prepared by Yu after the rushed HK release? Clearly he's revised his film. Who knows what this director's cut will add (or delete)? If you prefer the HK cut, fair enough, but I wouldn't suggest it's in any way more valid. If anything, it's less so.