Bullets 'n' Babes

gojensen wrote:Or get a Toshiba! You should be able to get it for around £200-£300 (?!) Then spring for the coming "cheap" Sony at £400-£500... Still cheaper (and better I dare say) than a Sammy/LG combo at £1000.

It's $1000 so will be about £500 and no way am I getting two players, that's stupid IMO, plus I already own a DVD Player which plays SACD/DVD-A and a Hard Disk/DVD Recorder that plays DVDs.

I'm sure as hell not having FOUR DVD players, three is overkill but cannot be helped.

slasher13 wrote:Oh get a PS3 with a hack that enable you to connect a USB HDDVD and hack s/ware to play the HD movies..

Really where?

saltysam wrote:i think my ps3 will be fine come october.

They've already said the PS3 is likely to be fine, as as it's a games console it has way more RAM and CPU power etc... than your average BD Player.

You cannot upgrade hardware via firmware

i have a toshiba hd/ps3/hdd dvd recorder/sky + under my telly

The only problem I really have is that neither the PS3 or the Toshiba HD-DVD players are region free DVD players. Meaning I can't use them to watch all my dvds...

When that day comes I'll be a happy camper

I'll just reiterate once though; those of you wanting to have both formats either by 2 players or a combo player is only doing yourself a disservice by prolonging the format wars... there is no reason WHATSOEVER that we should have to suffer through two incompatible but mostly identical formats. If this doesn't end HD movies goes the way of DVDA/SACD...

Fuck off viking Sony fanboy and listen your shitty fantasy metal. I'll be getting both a Xbox 360 and a PS3 regardless of HD optical formats and I don't want to go without Universal films.

gasteropod wrote:I love the way that the PS3 keeps getting updated. Just recently it got the 24fps function, yay!

Yup the one thing my TV cannot do I was gutted when I heard that, not that most people can even tell, hope I cannot see the shimmering stuff on HD.

My Regza outputs 24fps so I have it set like that, no I can't notice, but it gives me satisfaction

What FPS do most playback at then?

saltysam wrote:i have a toshiba hd/ps3/hdd dvd recorder/sky + under my telly

. Why do you need a HD Recorder if you have Sky+? I guess because it makes life easier to record to DVD, right?

gojensen wrote:The only problem I really have is that neither the PS3 or the Toshiba HD-DVD players are region free DVD players. Meaning I can't use them to watch all my dvds... . When that day comes I'll be a happy camper

One of the Samsung BD Players can be made DVD MR, not that I can see the big deal really.

gojensen wrote:I'll just reiterate once though; those of you wanting to have both formats either by 2 players or a combo player is only doing yourself a disservice by prolonging the format wars... there is no reason WHATSOEVER that we should have to suffer through two incompatible but mostly identical formats.

And I'll just reiterate not all of us want to wait 1-5 years just to get into HD. It's already been well over 12 months and there is no sign of it going anywhere.

I am not doing myself any disservice, I will be able to play ALL films now and if one format dies big deal it won't stop my player playing the titles back or stop me from just buying one format in future.

I agree your point but the reality is there is as much evidence to say it will never change as there is to say it will.

EvaUnit02 wrote:I don't want to go without Universal films.

Exactly! Not to mention all the slew of other HD-DVD exclusive titles. I can't see all of them being upgraded any time soon.

bradavon wrote:What FPS do most playback at then?

From what I understand its an odd thing, I thought my TV was future proofed, but its seems this magic 24 frames thing is the end thing to have which I just missed out on. I think most TV's try to "emulate" what signal they get (depending on the source I guess) and turn it somehow into 24 frames, even when its not, it creates a pulse on your screen sometimes apprently.
So 24 frames is apprently the best you can get, along with 1080p. But a lot of poeple say you either see your TV try to turn it into 24 FPS or you dont, some it bugs, some never see it, so the magic 24 frames may not be needed for most people This seems only to be on HD dvds mind you.

Standard LCDs convert the 24fps into 60hz, I think.

EvaUnit02 wrote:Fuck off viking Sony fanboy and listen your shitty fantasy metal. I'll be getting both a Xbox 360 and a PS3 regardless of HD optical formats and I don't want to go without Universal films.

Very nicely put...

One; I didn't say nothing about anyone having to choose BluRay
Two; I don't listen to shitty fantasy metal
Three; I bite my thumb at thee!

gasteropod wrote:Standard LCDs convert the 24fps into 60hz, I think.

Instead of what?

Thanks Romero.

Instead of... 24fps.... or 24hz

60Hz? I doubt anything runs at 24hz. I'm confused what all the difference is.

The PS3 now has the ability to output at 24Hz, and my Regza outputs at that if fed it.

gasteropod wrote:My Regza outputs 24fps so I have it set like that, no I can't notice, but it gives me satisfaction

No wonder I can't see the difference, I've done a bit of research and found this:

Toshiba X3030 1920*1080 | Full HD (1080p):
- Advertised as being 24hz-ready, but currently doesn't have the correct EDID data to tell devices like the PS3 that 24hz will work, so juddery video shows instead

Great. I've e-mailed Toshiba, and posted on the official PS3 forum, hoping that one of them will make an update.

One of them, bahhh! we souldnt have to update! bloody morons should be relasing perfect players, instead of silly hacks to get them working properly.

Right, I got a reply from Toshiba today, and there is a way to do it I just did what he said, and it's worked! Judder-free panning! Yes!

If anyone wants to know, you have to hold the standby button on your PS3 so that it goes into HDMI detect mode, and then tell it to set the optimum settings for your screen, so THEN it knows that the screen can take 24fps. I am so pleased! :mrgreen:

romerojpg wrote:From what I understand its an odd thing, I thought my TV was future proofed, but its seems this magic 24 frames thing is the end thing to have which I just missed out on. I think most TV's try to "emulate" what signal they get (depending on the source I guess) and turn it somehow into 24 frames, even when its not, it creates a pulse on your screen sometimes apprently.
So 24 frames is apprently the best you can get, along with 1080p. But a lot of poeple say you either see your TV try to turn it into 24 FPS or you dont, some it bugs, some never see it, so the magic 24 frames may not be needed for most people This seems only to be on HD dvds mind you.

Pretty much all HD content is put onto the disc (BD and HD DVD) at 24 frames per second because that is how it was made for the cinema.

Most TVs operate at 50 or 60Hz, (effectively 50 or 60 frames per second) and the 24 frames of the HD feed need to fit into those 60 refreshes.

This is fine in the UK for things at 25 FPS (e.g. PAL DVDs) because the 25 frames are just shown twice each to fit into a 50Hz refresh rate. This means that 25 FPS content is smoothly played back.

The problem arises with 24 FPS sources such as BD & HD DVD. 24 FPS does not fit easily into 50 or 60Hz. A technique called 3:2 pulldown is used to get the frames to fit.

3:2 pulldown means that the first frame is shown 3 times, then the second frame twice, third frame 3 times, fourth frame twice, and so on. This means a 24 FPS signal can fit into a 60Hz refresh. The jitter problem is caused on panning shots whereby frames are repeated in an uneven manner.

This effect can be seen on NTSC DVDs as well as BD & HD DVD, so if you don't notice the jitter on your NTSC DVDs, you won't notice it on the HD formats either.

The only reason there's a lot of talk about it now is because our UK BD & HD DVD discs are from 24 FPS masters. It was either that or have 25 FPS transfers that have been sped up (just like PAL DVDs).

As for TVs supporting 24 FPS, as far as I'm aware, there are none that will play back at 24Hz. The few (and I mean very few) that will cope with a 24 FPS signal without 3:2 pulldown operate at 72Hz - each of the 24 frames is repeated 3 times to fit into the 72Hz signal.

I think only the Pioneer high-end plasma screens feature 72Hz refresh & I don't know of any LCD screens that have that feature.

In short, I wouldn't worry about it - as long as your HDTV features a good 3:2 pulldown processor you shouldn't really notice the judder. Most people never notice it on NTSC DVDs, & its no different to that.

That explanation is probably as clear as mud to most people but its quite hard to explain without going into a lot of detail...

LOL I just read that there's a PS3 firmware update coming tomorrow which features forcing 24Hz output

Are you sure its forcing 24Hz? Or could it be a multiple of 24Hz, like 72Hz? If a PS3 forces 24Hz to an HDTV which doesn't support it, it will either show no signal or damage the TV, so I don't think 24Hz is a good idea at all...

My TV does support 24Hz, therefore I will be telling my PS3 to force it.

Your TV doesn't display at 24Hz, it accepts the signal and displays it at a higher multiple.

Exactly Lourdes. My guess is your TV will display the 24 FPS signal at 72Hz gasteropod.

Is that any good? Will 72Hz get rid of juddering?

It won't "get rid" of it, it just won't introduce it. Did you not read my detailed post?!

The 24 frames will be shown 3 times each, so there will be no judder.