Babel R2UK 2-disc SE - Spoilers!!!

EvaUnit02 · Post by **EvaUnit02** » 03 Apr 2007, 09:27

Britain wins again for having the best DVD of an Inarritu film. R2 gets a 90min doco, R1 is barebones. The yanks FAIL.

Paramount Home Entertainment have announced the UK Region 2 DVD release of Babel for 21st May 2007....

Available in One-Disc (£19.99) and Two-Disc (£22.99) editions the latter includes “Common Ground: Under Construction Notes” – a 90 minute feature length making-of video diary from director Alejandro Gonzalez Iñárritu.

Source =dvdtimes

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 05 Apr 2007, 16:58

Great stuff thanks, ahem:

* The same but with DTS too (HK R3): http://www.cd-wow.com/detail_results_2. ... de=1905250
* The same but with DTS and an extra interview (KR R3): http://www.dvdfromkorea.com/shop/p_detail.asp?idx=5267
* The same but with DTS, an extra interview and OST CD (KR R3 LE): http://www.dvdfromkorea.com/shop/p_detail.asp?idx=5266

I've ordered the HK R3, which is out now (and as usual cheap as chips). Before you say anything Eva I only noticed it early yesterday morning

HungFist · Post by **HungFist** » 05 Apr 2007, 17:13

I'd stay away from asian editions as I'm not so sure they come with subs that translate non-english dialogue only.

And will they (all) be uncensored? The koreans at least sometimes censor full frontal nudity. As do the japanese.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 09 Apr 2007, 16:45

HungFist wrote:I'd stay away from asian editions as I'm not so sure they come with subs that translate non-english dialogue only.

Shoot good point. I better find out. Thanks.

EDIT: According to CD WOW it has English subs but I bet they're on all the time

. If so I'll have to cancel my order.

HungFist wrote:And will they (all) be uncensored? The koreans at least sometimes censor full frontal nudity. As do the japanese.

I reckon the HK version will be okay, but yep you're right they like to do that in Korea (and Thailand).

Porn is pixelated in Japan but I don't think mainstream films are, are they?

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 11 Apr 2007, 17:25

Get this I tried to cancel my order for Babel HK and they've said it's not actually shipped but they cannot cancel the order as it's passed that stage but I can send it back when it returns.

They'll give me a stupid e-voucher to cover my postage costs. What an absurd thing to do, not to mention over the top. It's NOT shipped! I've told them they're being stupid, not that it will probably make much difference.

Word from CD WOW confirming the subs:

Sent: 11 April 2007 08:18
Subject: RE: CD WOW! DVD Query - Babel HK R3 - English subtitles query

As this is the HK release, the selectable English subs will subtitle all spoken languages, including the English sections of the film.

EvaUnit02 · Post by **EvaUnit02** » 11 Apr 2007, 18:31

Brad, please if it has burnt-in captions for the non-Englishy bits. Ta.

HungFist · Post by **HungFist** » 11 Apr 2007, 18:37

bradavon wrote: They'll give me a stupid e-voucher to cover my postage costs. What an absurd thing to do, not to mention over the top. It's NOT shipped! I've told them they're being stupid, not that it will probably make much difference.

That sucks. I ordered Bubba Ho Tep from cdwow a few months ago but cancelled it almost immediately when I realized the UK disc was single layer one disc re-release (my bad, I usually know what I'm buying). I was supposed to get a refund of course. A few days ago I realized that I actually haven't got anything back. Need to contact them now. Probably just a mistake but still...

bradavon wrote: Porn is pixelated in Japan but I don't think mainstream films are, are they?

I think that's about right but with R2J prices I have no interest in finding out personally

I do recall reading several years ago that Santa Sagre R2J was optically censored. It could've been an old japanese print though. New Love in Tokyo (1994 I think) is supposed to be the first japanese film to play officially uncensored. Before that a couple times the censors quite literally slept over a scene and the movie would accidentally play uncensored in cinemas till the theatre owners were arrested (it was considered their fault, for playing / not checking the print in advance). Some foreign films played uncensored on festivals before that (the french nearly turned it into an international conflict when the japanese tried to censor their films).

When it comes to Korean dvds, my Malena dvd (which I don't own anymore) was optically censored (only) if you chose korean subs....

saltysam · Post by **saltysam** » 11 Apr 2007, 21:06

What's with the love for Babel

watched an hour and switched off,pretentious crap

EvaUnit02 · Post by **EvaUnit02** » 12 Apr 2007, 00:57

saltysam wrote:What's with the love for Babel watched an hour and switched off,pretentious crap

Differing opinions, duh.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 13 Apr 2007, 23:06

HungFist wrote:Need to contact them now. Probably just a mistake but still...

That's strange whenever I cancel (and I'm not too late) I get a refund at the same time as the confirmation e-mail. In my case I was too late and it shipped making the previous point not important.

HungFist wrote:I think that's about right but with R2J prices I have no interest in finding out personally

Bloody good point.

Japanese porn is well weird, they stuff it up by pixelating everything except T&A but openly show people fucking literally on subway trains with complete strangers being filmed too. Not that I've seen much Japanese porn as I said it's pixelated.

HungFist wrote:When it comes to Korean dvds, my Malena dvd (which I don't own anymore) was optically censored (only) if you chose korean subs....

I have that and it's one weird censor job.

saltysam wrote:What's with the love for Babel watched an hour and switched off,pretentious crap

I can see why many thought it was pretentious. I happen to disagree though. I thought it was very powerful and especially the Japanese segment. I can see why Kermode thought that should be removed as the link is absurd but frankly I don't care, the segment makes the film.

The rest is very good too. But no it's not as good as Amores Perros or 21 Grams.

HungFist · Post by **HungFist** » 14 Apr 2007, 14:41

bradavon wrote:
saltysam wrote:What's with the love for Babel watched an hour and switched off,pretentious crap
I can see why many thought it was pretentious. I happen to disagree though. I thought it was very powerful and especially the Japanese segment. I can see why Kermode thought that should be remove at the link is absurd but frankly I don't care, the segment makes the film.

The rest is very good too. But no it's not as good as Amores Perros or 21 Grams.

This is strange. I actually agree with Brad. 100%.

Shingster · Post by **Shingster** » 14 Apr 2007, 17:57

I love Amores Perros and 21grams, but I thought Babel was contrived to the point of utter annoyance. The Japanese segment in particular was completely ridiculous! Quite possibly the most stupid extension of the western cinematic perception of asian women as "well up for it". Oh me so horny, me so horny! I love you long time!

Brad Pitt's segment was just as annoying, does Innaritu really expect us to believe that a Coach load of Westerners would go on a tour of the Middle East if they were so fucking shit scared of terroist attacks that they would simply abandon a dying woman? Anyone with half a brain in that situation would realise they weren't under attack after a good hour has passed with no more gunshots.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 14 Apr 2007, 22:29

Shingster wrote:The Japanese segment in particular was completely ridiculous! Quite possibly the most stupid extension of the western cinematic perception of asian women as "well up for it". Oh me so horny, me so horny! I love you long time!

You didn't find it powerful when she lost it with her father? I better not say any more.

You've missed the point of the Japanese lead showing her privates. She is deeply sad that know what seems to love her. It's got naff all to do with sex, being "well up for it" and being horny (far from it in fact). You did say you only saw the first hour so I can see why you came to that conclusion.

Shingster wrote:Anyone with half a brain in that situation would realise they weren't under attack after a good hour has passed with no more gunshots.

People may believe anything when they're paranoid and scared, in a land they don't know and will jump to conclusions.

HungFist wrote:This is strange. I actually agree with Brad. 100%.

It had to happen eventually

.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 14 Apr 2007, 22:30

As suspected it is removable English subs for the lot or nothing, no subtitle option just for English:

http://www.theimportforums.com/viewtopi ... 8&start=15

Pity as I wanted to open mine to watch the documentary but it's now going back. I can hold out a wee while longer for the UK R2 or R1 (which is bound to get a re-release) comes down in price. It's not even out yet and I'm waiting for a price drop

. From what I can tell the UK R2 is the same but minus DTS.

I'd prefer subs for just the non-English over DTS. Pity as I'd like that too.

Shingster · Post by **Shingster** » 15 Apr 2007, 00:08

bradavon wrote:
Shingster wrote:The Japanese segment in particular was completely ridiculous! Quite possibly the most stupid extension of the western cinematic perception of asian women as "well up for it". Oh me so horny, me so horny! I love you long time!
You didn't find it powerful when she lost it with her father? I better not say any more.

You've missed the point of the Japanese lead showing her privates. She is deeply sad that know what seems to love her. It's got naff all to do with sex, being "well up for it" and being horny (far from it in fact). You did say you only saw the first hour so I can see why you came to that conclusion.

It's all about intimacy issues with her, I am more than capable of perfectly understanding Babel's "intent", thanks.

I am saying that Inarritu took issues that certainly do apply to teenagers (and perhaps even more applicabler to Japanese teenagers), but he chose to convey these issues in the most heavy handed, unbelievable way. They also play into certain Western cinema steretypes of Oriental females as being highly sexed. I'm sure this is unintentional though.

People may believe anything when they're paranoid and scared, in a land they don't know and will jump to conclusions.

I'm as cyincal as the next man, but I'm willing to bet a million bucks that if you took a coachoload of real people and placed them in that same situation they would all be willing to at the very least hang around.

Now don't even get me started on the Mexican Wedding storyline, I haven't mentioned it because I seriously need to erase it from my memory forever if I'm ever going to accept Inarritu as a serious filmmaker ever again! :twisted:

HungFist · Post by **HungFist** » 15 Apr 2007, 08:29

bradavon wrote: People may believe anything when they're paranoid and scared, in a land they don't know and will jump to conclusions.

I agree with Brad again. I bunch on American people in Middle East... where everybody is supposed to hate them and want to kill them. And now one of them has been shot. You lose rational thinking and start believing in all those horror stories real quick under circumstances like that.

I saw a Finnish film critic saying that the film is racist with how it shows the foreigners (japanese teenage girl trying seduce a police man, a father giving a gun to his kids in middle east ect.). Right. It's like saying you can't have a black serial killer in a crime film because that would be racist. You can't have a gay killer because that would also be racist. Unless the director himself is gay or black. Then it's okay. Whether you are a racist or not depends on the color of your skin / your sexual orientation. Ironic, eh?

Most directors aren't skilled enough to make interesting movies of "normal" life. That's why they choose abnormal characters. That's all (usually). There's hardly a political message, even if the character was foreign, gay etc.

What I don't like about Babel is that the stories are connected to each other. It's not very believable that such dramatic things happen at the same time to people who are connected to each other. I would've prefered random characters.

Pitt and Blanchett were also bad choises. Their acting isn't that bad but they're just too big stars for a movie like this. IMO the point of that story was that two people were in trouble far from home, and the audience is supposed to feel the same, slighly claustrophobic. But with such big stars you don't always feel their desperation. It would've be easier to connect with the characters in that story if the actors were unknown.

The storyline in the Mexico part wasn't very good. It's just not very enjoyable or exciting to watch.

Pretty much everything else is great (including several parts in Mexico and Pitt stories). I can't be bothered to pay too much attention to those few weaknesses. It's never my intention to dislike a movie.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 15 Apr 2007, 12:17

Shingster wrote:They also play into certain Western cinema steretypes of Oriental females as being highly sexed. I'm sure this is unintentional though.

That is unfortunate as agreed many people who have an odd stereotypical view of far east Asians of being sexed up, particularly from Japan and Thailand. The Japanese as a nation are pretty sexually restrained but that doesn't mean they're sexed up.

That said in the case of the film I'm sure it was unintentional. It was necessary to make the film work.

Shingster wrote:I'm as cyincal as the next man, but I'm willing to bet a million bucks that if you took a coachoload of real people and placed them in that same situation they would all be willing to at the very least hang around.

If you remember they did hang around for ages in fact but if you have an inkling of fear you're eventually going to want to leave. Even forgetting the shooting you're going to want to get on with your life instead of hanging around all day. They didn't know her from Adam.

Did you really just watch the first hour?

HungFist wrote:I saw a Finnish film critic saying that the film is racist with how it shows the foreigners (japanese teenage girl trying seduce a police man, a father giving a gun to his kids in middle east ect.).

The fact is many middle eastern countries the father does give his children a gun or at least shows him how to use on. In this case he didn't give him a gun I seem to remember the kid nicking it.

HungFist wrote: Right. It's like saying you can't have a black serial killer in a crime film because that would be racist. You can't have a gay killer because that would also be racist.

Exactly. You mean homophobic btw.

The white world over the last decade has become VERY politically correct to the point you can't say anything which may be construed to be racist. A guy at work was asked to remove the word blacklist from some work he was doing, blacklist just means a negative list nothing at all to do with racism.

I saw a documentary recently that said the most hindered man in Britain is the "white male". It's acceptable to make fun of the Scottish accent but make fun of a West Indies accent and it's somehow racist (as proven in Britain by a recent advert that had to be pulled from the air, it wasn't remotely racist). It's perfectly acceptable for women to bitch about men as being useless but guys do it and they're suddenly sexist.

HungFist wrote:Most directors aren't skilled enough to make interesting movies of "normal" life. That's why they choose abnormal characters. That's all (usually). There's hardly a political message, even if the character was foreign, gay etc.

Obviously in Babel the director deliberately picked things to make the film more interesting but otherwise I agree with your statement.

HungFist wrote:What I don't like about Babel is that the stories are connected to each other. It's not very believable that such dramatic things happen at the same time to people who are connected to each other. I would've prefered random characters.

That was kind of the whole point though. I just wish he'd managed to come up with a much better way to connect the Japanese story.

But like I said most of the film was so powerful I don't care.

I've not even mentioned the acting. Cate Blanchett is always excellent, as is Gael Garcia Beneral, Brad Pitt was surprising good and what can I say about the Japanese lead she was outstanding.

Damn I'm annoyed the HK DVD has messed up subs I want to see this again now.

HungFist wrote:It would've be easier to connect with the characters in that story if the actors were unknown.

That's often the problem with known actors. When an actor gets so recognisable and more a star it's hard to forget that. Brad's beard oddly helped

It does show that I didn't feel this of Sean Penn in 21 Grams, he is such a good actor though. Better than Bras Pitt IMO, it really doesn't help to be pretty at times.

slasher13 · Post by **slasher13** » 15 Apr 2007, 14:57

Ooo this tread is interesting, I'm also one of the people who didn't like this movie. I just didn't get the japanese part really, I agree with Shingster on this, somes scenes especially the end where she is naked with the police officer didn't really need to be in the movie.

I actually did like the mexician part, and felt sorry for the old lady at the end.

Shingster · Post by **Shingster** » 15 Apr 2007, 19:15

bradavon wrote:Did you really just watch the first hour?

No I watched all of it, I never give up on films no matter how awful they are, and I certainly didn't think Babel was that bad. The hour comment was in reference to how long the coach tourists were prepared to wait in that village before they started moaning.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 15 Apr 2007, 20:32

LOL oops for some reason I got your and Salty Sam's posts mixed up

@ Slasher: You wanted to remove the segment where she's naked with the police officer than her father

.

p.s - I better add a spoiler tag to the thread title.

slasher13 · Post by **slasher13** » 16 Apr 2007, 07:34

Hey Bradavon, done, added in spoilers tags, but could someone just explain that part for me please. I just really didn't get why she done that

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 16 Apr 2007, 19:37

Cheers, it's okay though as I added Spoilers to the main thread title, see.

As for why she did that:

Her mother shot herself so she has all that trauma to deal with and understand. She feels her father doesn't understand her or her deafness. People run a mile as soon as she tries to communicate with them (in her eyes she thinks everyone thinks she's a freak), this is especially a problem as she cannot find a boyfriend. She is also a teenager and we all know how troublesome they can be.

She's attracted to the cop who shows her a small amount of affection (he's nice) and she's so desperate for love she literally throws herself at him. I suppose you have to try and put yourself in her shoes. She's not after sex in the slightest as Shingster says but someone to love her. "If this man sleeps with me he must love me right?"

In short she is deeply sad, upset and wishes someone would understand and love her. That's how I understood it anyway. I thought it was very powerful, and touched upon so nicely.

HungFist · Post by **HungFist** » 16 Apr 2007, 19:49

bradavon wrote:Cheers, it's okay though as I added Spoilers to the main thread title, see.

As for why she did that:

Her mother shot herself so she has all that trauma to deal with and understand. She feels her father doesn't understand her or her deafness. People run a mile as soon as she tries to communicate them (in her eyes she thinks everyone thinks she's a freak), this is especially a problem as she cannot find a boyfriend. She also a teenager and we all know how troublesome they can be.

She's attracted to the cop who shows her a small amount of affection (he's nice) and she's so desperate for love she literally throws herself at him. I suppose you have to try and put yourself in her shoes. She's not after sex in the slightest as Shingster says but someone to love her. "If this man sleeps with me he must love me right?"

In short she is deeply sad, upset and wishes someone would understand and love her. That's how I understood it anyway. I thought it was very powerful, and touched upon so nicely.

Keep writing Brad. Sooner or later you'll say something I disagree about.

This is a classic thread

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 16 Apr 2007, 21:01

It is indeed