New! BULLET IN THE HEAD... EXTENDED CUT!

gojensen · Post by **gojensen** » 25 Oct 2006, 19:14

Woo doesn't know how to direct actor's? Or maybe Woo just demands more from his actors? (Which is why Paycheck "bombed" in my opinion... Thurman and Affleck needed lots of direction - Woo needed actors whom could think for themselves...)

According to interviews from his early days as a director Woo was VERY good at directing actors - going so far as to at some point surpassing what the actor could manage to do. Woo however hasn't got that HK Moviestar look. (And he's no Peking Opera student either).

Anyhoo, I'm not sure Anthony Wong is the right man to criticize Woo

He did soooo great in HB compared with Chow and Leung - at least I found him a bit annoying. Philip Kwok is cool though :mrgreen:

thelostdragon · Post by **thelostdragon** » 25 Oct 2006, 21:58

Markgway wrote:Lo Wei never directed the action for his movies.

Not entirely true. Very rarely in the beginning of his career, he indeed did.

chenlung · Post by **chenlung** » 25 Oct 2006, 22:16

Lo never directed anything. He marely listened to the horses.

Strange Chen Chi Hwa was officially director for 'Shaolin Wooden Men' but Lo's name seems to be on the credits.

thelostdragon · Post by **thelostdragon** » 25 Oct 2006, 22:26

It's true that Lo Wei was very lazy during his later years, especially during the time when Jackie Chan worked under his wing (as it says in Jackie Chan's autobiography). Even under Bruce Lee, he'd often not even be there on the set. But he has officially directed over 60 films, of which I am sure he has really directed at least half of. And compared to his later films, they were suppsoed to have been really good. He didn't earn his reputation for shitty films and had a good reputation even before he made the Bruce Lee films. Good reputation as a director, not as a person, mind you. He was supposed to be like the Chinese Sam Peckinpah in terms of dealing with his actors.

Killer Meteor · Post by **Killer Meteor** » 26 Oct 2006, 12:56

I find Lo Wei acceptable as a director - the fact that he's bashed so much makes expectations lower, even my rather mainstream film teacher was aware of Lo's less than sterling rep. For every clunker like New Fist Of Fury, there's the Bruce Lee films, his films with Cheng Pei-pei, his Wang Yu films and so on. And his film The Comet Strikes has had very favourable notices. He's ordinary, good at times, and inconsistent, but then so was Chang Cheh, who started off with really good, emotional films and then gave up the ghost around '75. A bad Lo Wei you can ignore. A bad Chang Cheh film is painful.

On the subject of John Woo, an excellent director, though his Hollywood films are hit-and-miss. Chen Lung's opinion is unusual to say the least - what's wrong with excessive, beautiful violence - though I must admit I slightly prefer Ringo Lam.

Yi-Long · Post by **Yi-Long** » 26 Oct 2006, 13:08

Cant say I either hate or love Lo Wei. His Bruce Lee movies are OK, but that also has to do with the fact Bruce is in it ofcourse. Especially Fist of Fury.
I havent seen enough of his movies to make a fair judgement, although his Jackie Chan flicks, as mentioned before, were crap.
I think I only like 1 or 2 of his JC movies.

I dont know how Peckinpah treated his actors, as far as I know he was just very straight to the point, short-tempered maybe, and deadly honest... but I do know that McQueen liked him alot when they made Bullitt together.

I dont know what kind of director I would prefer if I were an actor. I have a problem with people bossing me around and shouting at me, so I think I'd be better off with a guy who knows what he's doing, and trusts me enough to do what I feel like doing...
But I guess some actors are so insecure that they want very strict guidelines and instructions as to where to stand, how to move, how to speak, so they can just follow that to a tee and get it over with...

Killer Meteor · Post by **Killer Meteor** » 26 Oct 2006, 14:15

As an amateur actor, I've suffered a lot with directors who either yell a lot or fail to communicate on any level, consequently dammaging my performance. The best director is one who maintains your confidence and gives you a clear idea of what they want.

Chi Kuan-chun said that Chang Cheh used to direct him in emotions "Emotion one - anger", Emotion 2 - sadness etc. and he didn't really learn to act until Wu Ma directed him.

Yi-Long · Post by **Yi-Long** » 26 Oct 2006, 16:24

Ivan Drago wrote:As an amateur actor, I've suffered a lot with directors who either yell a lot or fail to communicate on any level, consequently dammaging my performance. The best director is one who maintains your confidence and gives you a clear idea of what they want.

Chi Kuan-chun said that Chang Cheh used to direct him in emotions "Emotion one - anger", Emotion 2 - sadness etc. and he didn't really learn to act until Wu Ma directed him.

I almost was an ameteur actor once. But the guy who was doing the movie seemed a bit like the directors you describe. A friend of mine who knew him, said he could be a real biatch at times, very bossy and nagging and pushy etc.
I already got that feeling from him the few times I had met him, even though he was quite nice to me.

That's kind of the problem with these specially educated directors, who have gone through a special school and all that. They really feel like they are the only ones on the whole set who has a clue as what has to be done, and feels the need to constantly lecture and boss everyone around. Not ALL of them obviously, but many.

I think the best directors are the ones who are just looking and aiming to make a movie as good as possible AND have a good working experience and good learning experience, instead of those aiming for every fucking movie they make to win the next independent movie award at next year's Cannes.

Now that I've finished school and can call myself a (unemployed) graphic designer, I more and more get that urge to try and get into the acting/movie business.
Main things that are holding me back are the fear of having to work with guys like you just described, plus a slight health issue which has been going on for quite some time now, and I'm now working on fixing.

Killer Meteor · Post by **Killer Meteor** » 26 Oct 2006, 16:44

I directed a short fight sequence once as a demo and what I do is let the cast and crew contribute ideas before we shoot a frame.

Yi-Long · Post by **Yi-Long** » 26 Oct 2006, 17:00

Yeah that's probably best. Making a movie is a group-process, and it's in everyone's best interest when each individual can do his/her task the best way possible in his/her own way.

Obviously, the director has certain image in his head he wants to portray, so it's his job to explain that to his cast as good as possible, so they have a general idea of what he wants.

Ithink you often see the mistake in fightsequences in western TV-shows or movies, where the director/choreographer has a very strict idea of what he wants in that scene, moves-wise and all that, and doesnt realize that his/her actors might not be capable of doing that. Yet he makes them do it anyway. So you get to see high kicks that look like crap, spinning kicks that are a joke, etc etc... simply cause the director/choreographer was too strict on what he wanted, stuck to his guns, and the result is a crappy fight-scene.
While feel, and which is evidenced in many HK productions, that you can and SHOULD make a non-martial artists look very good, simply by letting him perform more simple things, yet be more creative with the overall choreography etc to HELP them look good.

Same goes with acting. You can see a clear difference between actors who have been told EXACTLY what to do (they're more stiff, unnatural, more 'forced', etc) and actors who have been given the confidence-vote to fill in the scene in their own way. A good example of an actor who is VERY natural, is Patrick Tam, who does so much more then just simply throw out his lines. Robert deNiro had a great scene in Copland where he was very relaxed in it (eating a sandwich).

A director should realize that limiting and restricting his actors in the way they portray their role, often shows up on screen, and can make a scene less good...

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 12 Dec 2006, 21:26

I hear the Joy Sales DVD pauses during the alternate cuts (thanks Hung). For those who're shocked no offence but did anyone honestly expect seamless branching?

I fully expected it to pause.

HungFist · Post by **HungFist** » 12 Dec 2006, 21:31

bradavon wrote:(thanks Hung)

????

Knetan · Post by **Knetan** » 12 Dec 2006, 21:33

hey,

how is this Finland's fault?

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 12 Dec 2006, 23:34

For those who don't know he is (thanks again to Hung) info on the BITH: JS DVD:

http://adg.invisionzone.com/index.php?s ... 033&st=400

Personally it wouldn't bother me provided I could watch the extra scenes separately but that's just my opinion.

EvaUnit02 · Post by **EvaUnit02** » 13 Dec 2006, 01:17

Yi-Long wrote:I dont know how Peckinpah treated his actors, as far as I know he was just very straight to the point, short-tempered maybe, and deadly honest... but I do know that McQueen liked him alot when they made Bullitt together.

Peckinpah didn't have anything to do with Bullitt. Peckinpah worked with McQueen on The Getaway, Junior Bonner (and The Cincinnati Kid before the studio gave him the sack and hired Norman Jewison to direct).

Aside from the fantasticly-edited car chase, Bullitt is really bland - especially the direction. The Getaway is miles better, thanks to Peckinpah's direction and Walter Hill's solid script.

Yi-Long · Post by **Yi-Long** » 13 Dec 2006, 01:23

[quote="EvaUnit02"]

Aw oki, thanks for clearing that up.
I must have been confused cause I saw it on the documentary that was on the Bullitt DVD, which indeed tells about ALL his movies, so also about The Getaway (great movie btw)

About Bullit: It was an OK movie, but not great. I didnt see it as an action flick but just as a movie about a cop trying to solve a case, and being hindered by people with different motives...
I wouldnt say anything was GREAT, except perhaps the editing, but still... it's a nice, enjoyable, and good movie overall.

EvaUnit02 · Post by **EvaUnit02** » 13 Dec 2006, 01:46

Yi-Long wrote:About Bullit: It was an OK movie, but not great. I didnt see it as an action flick but just as a movie about a cop trying to solve a case, and being hindered by people with different motives..

Yeah, Bullitt is okay. Most people of our generation tend to skip right to the car chase (I don't blame em, it is fantastic).

Otherwise the film is pretty bland, direction (by Peter Hyatt IIRC) is mediocre; the Lalo Scrifrin score is awful (I'm pretty biased though, since I hate all of Scrifrin's film scores from the 60's/70's); there are sub-plots that go nowhere (eg Bullitt's girlfriend). Where there should be tension, there is none (eg the baddie running away in the airport at the end - nothing but blah sound effects like those of plane turbines, zilch usage of music at all).

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 13 Dec 2006, 01:50

I didn't much care for The Getaway last time I saw it (SE DVD).

Tried to watch Bullitt on TV years ago but got bored.

Yi-Long · Post by **Yi-Long** » 13 Dec 2006, 01:51

Yeah, I agree with ya. There's a great movie hidden somewhere in there, but it never comes to the surface. It could have and should have been much better.
I think the reason why it's successfull/popular, is because it has McQueen in a role we like to see him in: no-nonsense, tough but fair cop. Oozing 'coolness'...

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 13 Dec 2006, 05:16

There's no heart to The Getaway - why should we care about these criminal characters? Same problem with the remake.

thelostdragon · Post by **thelostdragon** » 13 Dec 2006, 14:48

So HungFist, tell us, have you ever found that rare Aya Ueto AV?

HungFist · Post by **HungFist** » 13 Dec 2006, 15:27

It's a fake. Some chinese (?) lookalike who doesn't really look the least bit of Aya. Some people are just blind, it seems.

Kurgan · Post by **Kurgan** » 13 Dec 2006, 16:09

After searching long and hard for Aya Ueto AVs?

HungFist · Post by **HungFist** » 13 Dec 2006, 16:52

Kurgan wrote:After searching long and hard for Aya Ueto AVs?

To borrow someone's words; this is the idol who shocked the world by wearing a bikini top in her latest phtotobook...

the answer is no

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 13 Dec 2006, 19:34

HungFist wrote:Yes, it's me, I didn't know you were reading maniacs.

I don't but Salty pointed me that thread.

EvaUnit02 wrote:Aside from the fantasticly-edited car chase, Bullitt is really bland - especially the direction. The Getaway is miles better, thanks to Peckinpah's direction and Walter Hill's solid script.

Agreed. The Getaway is great.

EvaUnit02 wrote:Hung Fist aka HungFist aka Shurayuki aka Shurayuki-hime. I think that was all.

AKA - What's wrong with one handle? I'm bradavon everywhere

(except two forums where I'm bradavon78, as I can't get into my old account so gave up).

EvaUnit02 wrote:If you see a guy from Finland with Aya Ueto avatar, then it's me. There's only two Aya fans in this country, and the other one isn't a movie geek

We're not all obsessed enough to recognise her