Is multi-culturalism right for your country?

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 06 Jun 2006, 23:06

I don't see how giving constructive opinions on a subject is BS but anyway time for bed.

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 06 Jun 2006, 23:12

It's not... but the thought police are watching... waiting................ :bom:

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 06 Jun 2006, 23:16

I didn't think anyone would pick the third option, not on Bullets, but I figured I should provide the option in case. As if it wasn't obvious, I voted for option 2, all by myself.

You may not agree (I'm sure you don't) but I'm the only one who's so far had the balls to do so. The rest either agree with option A and simply haven't voted yet or choose B and are afraid of a tongue-lashing from the lefties.

thelostdragon · Post by **thelostdragon** » 06 Jun 2006, 23:25

I wasn't trying to be personal by connecting BS with the opinions of people. I was just using the word BS instead of "their opinion".

thelostdragon · Post by **thelostdragon** » 06 Jun 2006, 23:26

Markgway wrote:I didn't think anyone would pick the third option, not on Bullets, but I figured I should provide the option in case. As if it wasn't obvious, I voted for option 2, all by myself. You may not agree (I'm sure you don't) but I'm the only one who's so far had the balls to do so. The rest either agree with option A and simply haven't voted yet or choose B and are afraid of a tongue-lashing from the lefties.

LOL, so you believe that all those who do not share your opinion either have no balls or are lefties?

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 06 Jun 2006, 23:29

thelostdragon wrote:LOL, so you believe that all those who do not share your opinion either have no balls or are lefties?

I think it's a safe assumption. Can anyone who voted for option 1 and isn't left-leaning please post to prove me wrong.

thelostdragon · Post by **thelostdragon** » 06 Jun 2006, 23:41

LOL, I voted for option number one. I don't see what's there to write about? It's common sense to me.

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 06 Jun 2006, 23:54

thelostdragon wrote:It's common sense to me.

Not to me. I don't think immigrants should transport their cultures to the UK and live exactly the same as they would at home, just as I wouldn't want to turn wherever I went into Little Scotia, trot about in a kilt, and hold a Haggis festival outside my house.

thelostdragon · Post by **thelostdragon** » 06 Jun 2006, 23:58

They don't do that in Scotland anyway anymore, do they?

thelostdragon · Post by **thelostdragon** » 07 Jun 2006, 00:00

You see, I think immigrants should be allowed as they used to live as long as it is not against the law. At the same time, though, I'd want a law that requires immigrants to study the local language in spoken and written form, before they can get a citizenship.

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 07 Jun 2006, 00:10

thelostdragon wrote:They don't do that in Scotland anyway anymore, do they?

No idea. I hate Haggis since I found out the ingrediants. It tastes better than it reads.

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 07 Jun 2006, 00:13

thelostdragon wrote:You see, I think immigrants should be allowed as they used to live as long as it is not against the law. At the same time, though, I'd want a law that requires immigrants to study the local language in spoken and written form, before they can get a citizenship.

I think there's a sensible compromise in here somewhere. But to many multi-culturalism means fuck your own culture to make outsiders welcome and that obviously doesn't work. I was going to say "if I live in..." but one person is not a threat, but a joke. So I'll revise: If 50,000 Scots moved to Cologne (that's where you're at?) dressed, spoke and acted as "we" did back home you would be cool with that? If I were German I wouldn't.

thelostdragon · Post by **thelostdragon** » 07 Jun 2006, 00:30

Markgway wrote:If I were German I wouldn't.

Why not?

I mean it's not like all those immigrants came on the same day to the countries we are living in. Most of the immigrants here contribute to society, by working and paying taxes. I think I would not have a problem with 100.000 Scottish people coming to Cologne. If they really all came on the same day, it would be some kind of a cultural shock for the first few weeks, I'm sure about that. But as long as they only "dress", "speak" and "act" as they do in Scotland, without violating the German law... why not?

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 07 Jun 2006, 00:36

thelostdragon wrote:But as long as they only "dress", "speak" and "act" as they do in Scotland, without violating the German law... why not?

Prepare the spare room... I'm on my way

Kurgan · Post by **Kurgan** » 07 Jun 2006, 01:25

Markgway wrote:Not to me. I don't think immigrants should transport their cultures to the UK and live exactly the same as they would at home, just as I wouldn't want to turn wherever I went into Little Scotia, trot about in a kilt, and hold a Haggis festival outside my house.

I think there's a sensible compromise in here somewhere. But to many multi-culturalism means fuck your own culture to make outsiders welcome and that obviously doesn't work. I was going to say "if I live in..." but one person is not a threat, but a joke. So I'll revise: If 50,000 Scots moved to Cologne (that's where you're at?) dressed, spoke and acted as "we" did back home you would be cool with that? If I were German I wouldn't.

Seems like there's a lot of revising of questions and statements going on here

To be fair, that's the kinda point I was attempting to clarify earlier on. I want the transportation of culture, but not at the expense of the existing one. Like I said, there's a middle ground to be met, but your damn choice of answers didn't cater for that.

I think you should revise the question and answer again (just cos you seem to be a old hand at it now

) and see how many people choose the option just outlined.

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 07 Jun 2006, 10:49

I admit it's not the easiest question to word (and answer) and maybe a poll wasn't the best option. I just know how you lot love to vote.

Kurgan · Post by **Kurgan** » 07 Jun 2006, 11:09

I dunno about that. 5 votes out of over 200 registered members?

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 07 Jun 2006, 11:49

thelostdragon wrote:You see, I think immigrants should be allowed as they used to live as long as it is not against the law. At the same time, though, I'd want a law that requires immigrants to study the local language in spoken and written form, before they can get a citizenship.

I couldn't agree more. Exactly my thoughts too.

Most in the UK I'd say agree with Mark which is a shame IMO as it just means more of the "why don't foreigners speak English argument" (as if all foreigners can be put in the same group) and "I've no problem with foreigners but why can't they speak English" and "they're all foreigners at call centres"

It also means multiculturalism is dead and the thriving Asian and immigrant communities would die. It also leads to hatred and in the extreme terrorism.

If someone can speak fluent English (for example) and can do a job in Britain as well as a local then what actual harm are they causing also knowing something about another culture?

To many people in the UK live in their little box that "Britain is the best country in the world", "everyone should speak English fluently" and if they make a mistake speaking it they're somehow stupid.

To many people deliberately ignore the fact it's immigrants who do the shit jobs many local wouldn't do.

The world would be a better place if people had a better understanding of their neighbours. This is never going to happen if multiculturalism is completely trampled on.]

I'm leaning towards A but on the whole LD above as summarised it better.

Markgway wrote:Can anyone who voted for option 1 and isn't left-leaning please post to prove me wrong.

What does left and right leaning mean? The Lib. Dems are left right with the Conservatives being right?

Kurgan wrote:5 votes out of over 200 registered members?

Very few ever vote even if they do comment and really it's 12-15 members with about 6-8 active every week.

Kurgan · Post by **Kurgan** » 07 Jun 2006, 14:57

bradavon wrote:Very few ever vote even if they do comment and really it's 12-15 members with about 6-8 active every week.

I know. Hence the

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 07 Jun 2006, 16:43

bradavon wrote:Most in the UK I'd say agree with Mark which is a shame IMO as it just means more of the "why don't foreigners speak English argument" (as if all foreigners can be put in the same group) and "I've no problem with foreigners but why can't they speak English"

Why shouldn't foreigners who come to the UK speak English? English is still the national language last time I checked. If I went to live in Spain - guess what? - I'd learn Spanish. I'm not dictating what people should speak in their own homes. You make it sound so facist.

It also means multiculturalism is dead and the thriving Asian and immigrant communities would die. It also leads to hatred and in the extreme terrorism.

Nonsense. Racism has gotten worse since multicultalism began to dominate Britain, not better. And it's not just one-sided. The biggest tensions in England are often between Black and Asian communities, the immigrants themselves. And you may not agree with this, but I don't think there should be ethnic communities (or ghettos as they can easily become) just communities where every race lives alongside one another united as Brits.

If someone can speak fluent English (for example) and can do a job in Britain as well as a local then what actual harm are they causing also knowing something about another culture?

No harm but you've got children of immigrants who identify more closely with their parents' cultures than that of the country their born and raised in. Isn't that a problem?

To many people in the UK live in their little box that "Britain is the best country in the world", "everyone should speak English fluently" and if they make a mistake speaking it they're somehow stupid.

I've no idea what the best country in the world is, everyone who lives here should at least learn to speak English fluently, and who would condemn someone for making an honest mistake? Not me.

To many people deliberately ignore the fact it's immigrants who do the shit jobs many local wouldn't do.

Since when did this become about sending immigrants packing... sure I put that as an option for sake of balance but I never brought it up. I appreciate the good work many foreigners contribute to this country. I'm not anti-foreigner so please don't imply that. Without Asians the NHS would fall apart - and I'm not exaggerating. This has nothing to do with culture.

The world would be a better place if people had a better understanding of their neighbours. This is never going to happen if multiculturalism is completely trampled on.

Multicultralism and understanding of neighbouring countries do not go hand-in-hand. I have no problem learning about the French, for example, but I don't necessarily want to visit Le Glasgow.

What does left and right leaning mean? The Lib. Dems are left right with the Conservatives being right?

Eh?

Kurgan wrote:Very few ever vote even if they do comment and really it's 12-15 members with about 6-8 active every week.

Right. Why register with a forum and then never post. Come on you lurkers get stuck in.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 07 Jun 2006, 17:26

Markgway wrote:
What does left and right leaning mean? The Lib. Dems are left right with the Conservatives being right?
Eh?

What's confusing? I don't get all this left vs. right politics stuff.

Markgway wrote:
What does left and right leaning mean? The Lib. Dems are left right with the Conservatives being right?
Eh?

What's confusing? I don't get all this left vs. right politics stuff.

Why shouldn't foreigners who come to the UK speak English? English is still the national language last time I checked.[/quote
Huh? I was agreeing with LD who said they should take language lessons. I didn't say that. I was referring to locals complaining when immigrants don't speak it fluently (i.e - as locals do) or with an accent.

Markgway wrote:I'm not anti-foreigner so please don't imply that.

That was a general comment not aimed at you in particular as were the other comments in speech marks.

Kurgan · Post by **Kurgan** » 07 Jun 2006, 17:26

Markgway wrote:
Kurgan wrote:Very few ever vote even if they do comment and really it's 12-15 members with about 6-8 active every week.
Right. Why register with a forum and then never post. Come on you lurkers get stuck in.

I said nothing of the sort! Retract that statement right now!

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 08 Jun 2006, 01:12

Sorry, it was Brad, I made a mistake whilst quoting.

Hey, you MIGHT have said it though... 8)

grim_tales · Post by **grim_tales** » 12 Jun 2006, 12:37

I voted yes, however of course if people come here they should keep their culture/traditions obviously, but also try to intergrate into British life IMO if that makes sense (but not so it gets stupid like that "English" couple in the sketch show Goodness Gracious Me)

Its the same reason why Brits going on holiday should try to learn the language and stuff and eat local food, instead of just speaking English all the time

Unrealnils · Post by **Unrealnils** » 12 Jun 2006, 14:29

I have to say res, as my parents came over in the late sixites and becuase of that i was born here .........