Breaking News! Cine-Asia is reviving Hong Kong Legends

[HungFist]

It's not the lack of new extras or alternate footage that bothers me - I never expected that - but the fact that they're not taking the perfect opportunity to fix past mistakes. I mean does ANYONE still want a pinkified Fist of Fury or a cropped Police Story 2?

The point is: how much money would Cine Asia make or lose if they did correct those mistakes? It would cost them money to create new transfers. These re-releases have very limited financial potential. Most people own these films already and won't buy them again on DVD even if improved versions were released. The ones who will buy them will probably buy them regardless of transfer shortcomings. I can't really imagine more than a handful of hardcore fans purchasing the improved dvds (for that reason). And I'm not sure that it be enough to compensate for the extra cost of creating new transfers.

[luckystars]

It's not the lack of new extras or alternate footage that bothers me - I never expected that - but the fact that they're not taking the perfect opportunity to fix past mistakes. I mean does ANYONE still want a pinkified Fist of Fury or a cropped Police Story 2?

I can see beyond the relatively insignificant 'warming up' of the colour pallet in FOF. The platinum edition is still a world best version of FOF however you look at it. Mandarin and superb subs...no dumbing down like on a typical R1 release.

Again Police Story 2 has superb subs and really very nice sounding Cantonese audio (PS1 sounds awful in comparison). Ok there are faming issues if you compare to the next best DVD...but its no more than we all used to lose from overscan on our perfectly good CRT TV's.

[luckystars]

The point is: how much money would Cine Asia make or lose if they did correct those mistakes? It would cost them money to create new transfers. These re-releases have very limited financial potential. Most people own these films already and won't buy them again on DVD even if improved versions were released. The ones who will buy them will probably buy them regardless of transfer shortcomings. I can't really imagine more than a handful of hardcore fans purchasing the improved dvds (for that reason). And I'm not sure that it be enough to compensate for the extra cost of creating new transfers.

No Cine-Asia should go straight to Fortune Star for genuine HD masters, and just do their best to match them with good audio and subs...port over the old extras and put the films out on Blu-Ray. They can easily downmix the whole project into new DVD editions then if they wish - a walk in the park for experienced techs...and something they do everyday with their other projects.

But I'm not calling for Cine-Asia to do this today, I'm happy for it when it comes.

[Killer Meteor]

It's not the lack of new extras or alternate footage that bothers me - I never expected that - but the fact that they're not taking the perfect opportunity to fix past mistakes. I mean does ANYONE still want a pinkified Fist of Fury or a cropped Police Story 2?

I can see beyond the relatively insignificant 'warming up' of the colour pallet in FOF. The platinum edition is still a world best version of FOF however you look at it. Mandarin and superb subs...no dumbing down like on a typical R1 release.

Again Police Story 2 has superb subs and really very nice sounding Cantonese audio (PS1 sounds awful in comparison). Ok there are faming issues if you compare to the next best DVD...but its no more than we all used to lose from overscan on our perfectly good CRT TV's.

I think it's more the case of why tamper in the first place?

PS2 is not only cropped, its very stretched. I was surprised at how much image it's missing compared to the other dvds - much more then reviews had lead me to expect.

I think these things bug me a) because I'd rather they were right and b) often reviews were so good, I didn't find out about these flaws until it was too late to return the disc.

[luckystars]

It's not the lack of new extras or alternate footage that bothers me - I never expected that - but the fact that they're not taking the perfect opportunity to fix past mistakes. I mean does ANYONE still want a pinkified Fist of Fury or a cropped Police Story 2?

I can see beyond the relatively insignificant 'warming up' of the colour pallet in FOF. The platinum edition is still a world best version of FOF however you look at it. Mandarin and superb subs...no dumbing down like on a typical R1 release.

Again Police Story 2 has superb subs and really very nice sounding Cantonese audio (PS1 sounds awful in comparison). Ok there are faming issues if you compare to the next best DVD...but its no more than we all used to lose from overscan on our perfectly good CRT TV's.

I think it's more the case of why tamper in the first place?

PS2 is not only cropped, its very stretched. I was surprised at how much image it's missing compared to the other dvds - much more then reviews had lead me to expect.

I think these things bug me a) because I'd rather they were right and b) often reviews were so good, I didn't find out about these flaws until it was too late to return the disc.

Sure. You're a Cinema purest and I respect that. But for me, I'd rather watch that copy than have the broken English subs on the deltamac. Plus it's got a great Benny Lai interview on the disc. And I haven't the shelf space to keep 4 copies of every movie

[Killer Meteor]

Good points - HKLs subs were often great!

I actually don't own an official DVD of PS2 - I have a custom made dvd-r lol

[Markgway]

The point is: how much money would Cine Asia make or lose if they did correct those mistakes? It would cost them money to create new transfers. These re-releases have very limited financial potential. Most people own these films already and won't buy them again on DVD even if improved versions were released. The ones who will buy them will probably buy them regardless of transfer shortcomings. I can't really imagine more than a handful of hardcore fans purchasing the improved dvds (for that reason). And I'm not sure that it be enough to compensate for the extra cost of creating new transfers.

I don't think a simple colour adjustment would incur great expense.

If all Cine Asia are doing is putting new packaging on old shit they don't deserve to make any money.

The cropping fuck-up on PS2 is so bad they should be embarrassed about putting their name on it.

[Killer Meteor]

Not to mention the PS2 DVD cover, the HKL one at least, is guilty of false advertisement. A lot of HKL DVDs say 16:9 but the PS2 one was specific enough to say 2.35:1...

[bradavon]

No it says they improve subtitles on new releases and compile exclusive extras too.

Correct if I'm wrong but that is in responce to their own Cine-asia releases and also the work they used to do when working at HKL. It says they only get the HKL releases through the BBFC now.

Not touching that cut version of Fong Sai Yuk or The Legend or whatever the fuck they're calling it now...

I don't disagree outright but the trouble is, the Japanese DVD has no English subs and both HK DVDs are fucking atrocious. As far as I'm aware this is the only half decent version with English subs (cuts aside).

It's not the lack of new extras or alternate footage that bothers me - I never expected that - but the fact that they're not taking the perfect opportunity to fix past mistakes. I mean does ANYONE still want a pinkified Fist of Fury or a cropped Police Story 2?

It looks like they're not allowed. These are purely re-releases, just like the Dragon Dynasty discs put out by Cine-asia. Again correct me if I'm wrong here.

No Cine-Asia should go straight to Fortune Star for genuine HD masters

Do Fortune Star have them though?

I think it's more the case of why tamper in the first place?[/quote
Maybe not but it's done now. No point crying over split milk and all that.

If all Cine Asia are doing is putting new packaging on old shit they don't deserve to make any money.

What about the average consumer who missed the HKL discs the first time? Should they miss out? Remember the majority of people who buy DVDs only buy from the shop or online store in the country they live in. They may not be perfect but the HKL discs were a damn sight better than plenty of the other discs companies put out elsewhere. Agreed?

The cropping fuck-up on PS2 is so bad they should be embarrassed about putting their name on it.

I don't reckon the average consumer would notice.

I think Hung has basically hit the nail on the head here. Yes they should be perfect but it looks like A: That would cost money Cine-asia aren't prepared to spend, B: They're not allowed to alter the disc contents or C: A mixture of both.

If they were to fix Police Story 2, they'd have to go back and fix every single release (doesn't every release have some type of flaw?) and that would definitely cost lots of money. Besides this is all irrelevant, we've been told these are re-releases and nowt we say is going to change that.

[Markgway]

If they were to fix Police Story 2, they'd have to go back and fix every single release (doesn't every release have some type of flaw?) and that would definitely cost lots of money.

Many discs were good. I have no time for the 5.1 remixes as you know but if the mono tracks cost extra cash I don't see Cine Asia stumping up - even if they could. But beyond that films with easily fixable flaws (ie. dubtitles on Heart of Dragon) should be fixed. And seeing as it was HKL who buggered the colours on Fist of Fury (Fortune Star already supllied them with a mint master) it surely wouldn't cost a great deal to undo the damage (especially if they have any plans to Blu Ray these).

[luckystars]

Many discs were good. I have no time for the 5.1 remixes as you know but if the mono tracks cost extra cash I don't see Cine Asia stumping up - even if they could. But beyond that films with easily fixable flaws (ie. dubtitles on Heart of Dragon) should be fixed. And seeing as it was HKL who buggered the colours on Fist of Fury (Fortune Star already supllied them with a mint master) it surely wouldn't cost a great deal to undo the damage (especially if they have any plans to Blu Ray these).

Your assuming Contender doesn't own, or Brian White didn't take his project source materials when he left. I'm sure HKL had a lot of stuff on loan too..it's not known whether stuff was necessarily kept after each DVD was rolled out.

They will know about the Fortune Star remix issues. Titles Warriors Two that can't have sold well...I've heard that some of the latter DVD's only sold in very low numbers. They'll remember that..

[bradavon]

Many discs were good.

Agreed. Name me one HKL DVD that everyone liked though? I cannot think of one.

That article seems to say they're not allowed to change the discs but agreed if they're planning to release blu-rays. Those will have to be new.

[Yi-Long]

Many discs were good.

Agreed. Name me one HKL DVD that everyone liked though? I cannot think of one.

That article seems to say they're not allowed to change the discs but agreed if they're planning to release blu-rays. Those will have to be new.

Miracles? The 2nd release of Iron Monkey? Full Contact?

[grim_tales]

Miracles and Iron Monkey were excellent releases. I did like the original HKL promo for Iron Monkey (the 1st DVD) though.
I didnt have their DVD of "Full Contact".

[luckystars]

I've got 10 or 15 HKLs and I consider them my preferred viewing choice for all the films.

[Killer Meteor]

Many discs were good.

Agreed. Name me one HKL DVD that everyone liked though? I cannot think of one.

That article seems to say they're not allowed to change the discs but agreed if they're planning to release blu-rays. Those will have to be new.

These HKLs are fine as far as I'm concerned -

BLACK SHEEP AFFAIR
HITMAN
ARMOUR OF GOD
SWORDSMAN
CHINESE GHOST STORY 1 & 2
AVENGING FIST
NAKED KILLER
NAKED WEAPON
BULLET IN THE HEAD
FLAMING BROTHERS
DRAGON FROM RUSSIA
TIGER ON THE BEAT
WINNERS AND SINNERS
GAME OF DEATH 2
HONG KONG 1941
ICEMAN COMETH
POLICE ASSASSINS
IN THE LINE OF DUTY
IRON MONKEY
PURPLE STORM
2000 AD
MIRACLES
KING OF BEGGARS
CITY HUNTER
SCORPION KING
WING CHUN
TAI CHI BOXER
BEAST COPS


HKLs I have issues with...

BIG BOSS/WAY OF THE DRAGON - no Mandarin audio

FIST OF FURY/WHEELS ON MEALS - pinkification

MAGNIFICENT WARRIORS/POLICE STORY 2/LEGEND OF A FIGHTER/DRUNKEN MASTER/SNAKE IN THE EAGLE'S SHADOW - excessive cropping

SKINNY TIGER, FATTY DRAGON/ODD COUPLE/WARRIORS TWO etc - VERY BADLY REMIXED

POLICE STORY/MAGNIFICENT BUTCHER - excessively squished

YOUNG MASTER/DRAGON LORD/ZU WARRIORS - awkward remixing

[grim_tales]

LEGEND OF A FIGHTER is also the wrong language (should be Cantonese) but it still works in Mandarin IMO.
I'd buy BIG BOSS if a reconstruction was made incorporating all the lost footage (like that will ever happen)

[bradavon]

Miracles? The 2nd release of Iron Monkey? Full Contact?

None of those had the original audio. Someone complained . But agreed both Iron Monkey releases were excellent (in terms of AV there wasn't really much difference) still world class for that film.

I thought Fist of Fury PE was/is excellent too though. Yes it's pinker than the older HKL DVD but in every other respect it's miles better.

LEGEND OF A FIGHTER is also the wrong language (should be Cantonese) but it still works in Mandarin IMO.

Isn't that the only DVD worldwide? Making it a particular bitch.

[luckystars]

The thing with Legend of a Fighter is that various territories all had different cuts.

HKL synched Mandarin audio with a complete German print. The HK print had some alternate scenes so the audio wouldn't fit..

I honestly think they did the best job possible within their resources.
The surviving Seasonal films masters are renowned for being in a very poor state.

[grim_tales]

I think it was the only DVD worldwide for LOAF, yeah.
Brad are you saying Miracles, Iron Monkey, FC had remixes? If they did I didnt notice TBH. Does the HKL of FC have a complete Cantonese track? The Columbia switched to English for 3s or so.

[luckystars]

You do know there are good remixes and bad remixes?

[Killer Meteor]

The thing with Legend of a Fighter is that various territories all had different cuts.

HKL synched Mandarin audio with a complete German print. The HK print had some alternate scenes so the audio wouldn't fit..

I honestly think they did the best job possible within their resources.
The surviving Seasonal films masters are renowned for being in a very poor state.

True, but the cropping...

I don't mind an old beat up print, I was perfectly happy with Soulblade's SNUFF BOTTLE CONNECTION. HKL went to the trouble of remastering LEGEND OF A FIGHTER but then went and ruined what should have been a great release with the cropping. That said, I'm grateful they released it in some form as its a cracking rare movie, Grommit!

[Markgway]

I don't mind an old beat up print, I was perfectly happy with Soulblade's SNUFF BOTTLE CONNECTION.

So was I until I found out it was a german print missing about 5 mins of footage.

You do know there are good remixes and bad remixes?

There are only bad remixes.

[luckystars]

There are only bad remixes.

Rubbish.

Super-anal fans are never satisfied.

[Killer Meteor]

There are a lot of remixes that sound perfectly fine. Subtlety is the answer. That said, I'd rather they didn't bother in the first place!