John Woo's The Killer

Killer Meteor · Post by **Killer Meteor** » 03 Feb 2008, 14:16

I loathe those Chinglish burnt-in subs but sometimes that's the only way to see the films

Knetan · Post by **Knetan** » 03 Feb 2008, 14:39

hey,

and The Killer subs I remember being sharp enough to presumeably be readable all throughout...and understood if you have a brain.

EvaUnit02 · Post by **EvaUnit02** » 03 Feb 2008, 15:34

dvdvision wrote:Why not just get the longer version from the HK video DVD with english/chinese subs ? For me it's the ideal of course it's not the theatrical.

Because the IQ is rubbish and The Killer TC already has bad pacing in places. It doesn't need any pointless additional scenes, like the one where Little Eagle beats up some street punks.

grim_tales · Post by **grim_tales** » 03 Feb 2008, 15:55

On Disc 2, even if you turn the French subs off, they still come on when Sally Yeh says "I beg of you!" (or something like that)

HungFist · Post by **HungFist** » 03 Feb 2008, 16:34

EvaUnit02 wrote:
dvdvision wrote:Why not just get the longer version from the HK video DVD with english/chinese subs ? For me it's the ideal of course it's not the theatrical.
The Killer TC already has bad pacing in places.

Yes, it's too fast.

EvaUnit02 wrote: It doesn't need any pointless additional scenes, like the one where Little Eagle beats up some street punks.

Such scene is not in the extended cut. Have you even seen that version, or are you basing your opinions on the deleted scenes found of the HKL disc?

Although many of my favourite scenes are missing in the TC (was this scene on the HKL dvd at all?) most of the "additions" are just a second or two here and there. The action scenes especially are much better edited in the longer cut.

The real problem with the long cut is that it's in mandarin. To me it's no problem since I've always been watching the movie in mandarin (I only saw the cantonese TC a few years ago for the first time) but to most other people it probably would be.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 03 Feb 2008, 16:39

IMO it's immaterial how good/bad the Extended Cut is when only the way to see it is the French DVD. It's not as if it drastically alters the film like other Extended Cuts.

grim_tales wrote:On Disc 2, even if you turn the French subs off, they still come on when Sally Yeh says "I beg of you!" (or something like that)

No they don't. I used to own it.

HungFist · Post by **HungFist** » 03 Feb 2008, 16:56

bradavon wrote:IMO it's immaterial how good/bad the Extended Cut is when only the way to see it is the French DVD.

And what the hell is that supposed to mean?

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 03 Feb 2008, 16:59

It means what I said. The French DVD is so poor that it's just not worth enduring "when" the extra footage adds very little. If it added lots then maybe but it doesn't.

HungFist · Post by **HungFist** » 03 Feb 2008, 17:06

bradavon wrote:It means what I said. The French DVD is so poor that it's just not worth enduring "when" the extra footage adds very little. If it added lots then maybe but it doesn't.

Oh, right, didn't realize you were referring to the quality. I thought you had something against France

In my books the difference is big enough to affect on the film's rating. But I guess that's also related to which version you originally saw.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 03 Feb 2008, 17:11

HungFist wrote:Oh, right, didn't realize you were referring to the quality. I thought you had something against France

You what?

HungFist wrote:In my books the difference is big enough to affect on the film's rating. But I guess that's also related to which version you originally saw.

The extended cut and the subs made it hard to follow.

grim_tales · Post by **grim_tales** » 03 Feb 2008, 17:51

bradavon wrote:IMO it's immaterial how good/bad the Extended Cut is when only the way to see it is the French DVD. It's not as if it drastically alters the film like other Extended Cuts.

grim_tales wrote:On Disc 2, even if you turn the French subs off, they still come on when Sally Yeh says "I beg of you!" (or something like that)
No they don't. I used to own it.

I'm sure they do, its only for one line though.

RickyTheDragonSteamboat · Post by **RickyTheDragonSteamboat** » 03 Feb 2008, 19:52

Is the "extended" version found on the Frenchie in Cantonese or Mandarin? I've read contradicting reviews.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 03 Feb 2008, 20:14

Mandarin. It's sourced from Taiwan.

grim_tales wrote:I'm sure they do, its only for one line though.

I'm sure they don't. I didn't make it up I used to own it

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 04 Feb 2008, 02:32

The action scenes especially are much better edited in the longer cut.

That's interesting....

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 04 Feb 2008, 15:43

Bare in mind only Hung seems to think so. That's not a sarcastic comment.

HungFist · Post by **HungFist** » 04 Feb 2008, 18:45

I feel the action has better continuity. You can clearly see how pieces are missing from from the TC.

I did something so that we won't have to rely on each others words (:D). Below is a rar file, that includes small avi clips from some of the new scenes and differences as well as comparison clips from the theatrical cut. The file is 60 MB, and features 15 clips in total.

Don't take any kind of quality reference from these clips, I don't really know how to use this software (there may be some cropping etc). I tried to include only scenes that you haven't seen on the HKL or Criterion dvds (as deleted scenes).

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=1EPFFO54

Note: that's only some of the differences. I don't even know the exact differences.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 04 Feb 2008, 19:01

Good work thanks Hung.

thelostdragon · Post by **thelostdragon** » 05 Feb 2008, 00:14

Thanks, Hung!

Just noticed that the song in "Different music TC.avi" is in none of the versions I own if I remember correctly.

dvdvision · Post by **dvdvision** » 05 Feb 2008, 09:07

You won't, ever find a better version of the longer cut unless a miracle happen. I believe the print HK found was in the middle of a pool of water in a warehouse. They transferred it the best they could, most of the damage is in the print itself.

I personnaly prefer the longer cut because on the initial release worlwide (I'm speaking VHS bootlegs here), this was the cut that was available for unofficial rental in all Chinatowns all over. I know, I had about 5 versions of it, all with the same cut. I love the most quieter, contemplative moments. They help make the action more efficient and less of a bombardement.

Same goes for ABT 3, the longer cut was the one the initially went out, before shorter cuts found their way, but about 6 months after release (believe it or not, I had the fuzzy VHS of ABT3 about 1 month before it came out in Hong Kong in the cinemas).

Now speaking of The Killer, I asked David Wu what was his favorite version, and thought he like both, he also prefer the longer cut because it allows time to breathe for the movie. He says the initial cut he did was the long one, John Woo did trim it down for HK release.

HungFist · Post by **HungFist** » 06 Feb 2008, 13:57

thelostdragon wrote:Thanks, Hung!

Just noticed that the song in "Different music TC.avi" is in none of the versions I own if I remember correctly.

You're right. I checked the dvd, and the french dub has a different song than the cantonese version. And then the mandarin extended version of course has yet another different song.

Here's the song from the FR dub (I think this is the song that is used on other dvds as well, but for some reason not on HK Video's cantonese track):

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=RKSKG0UL