Should I change browser?

[Markgway]

Yeah, I might have to try them as it's obviously a matter of personal preference.

I quite like having my bookmarks always present. I do use them a lot. Often multiples at the same time.

[Yi-Long]

Yeah, I might have to try them as it's obviously a matter of personal preference.

I quite like having my bookmarks always present. I do use them a lot. Often multiples at the same time.

Avant also has all your bookmarks. Also on the left. If you want. Or on the right. If you want.

[bradavon]

What's your line of expertise again Yi? Not IT like myself and Shing I believe.

Mark, get switching .

[Yi-Long]

What's your line of expertise again Yi? Not IT like myself and Shing I believe.

What's your IQ again, Brad!? Not a 142, like myself I believe.

Mark, get switching .

Mark, before you 'get switching', ask yourself this: Am I going to take advice from Brad, or am I gonna use the 1 non-alcoholic braincell that's still working, and trust Yi on this one!?

[bradavon]

Mark, before you 'get switching', ask yourself this: Am I going to take advice from Brad, or am I gonna use the 1 non-alcoholic braincell that's still working, and trust Yi on this one!?

I hope he would take advice from those who work in the IT field, search the Internet and his own opinion by trying Chrome, Firefox, Opera and just to please you Avant. Seriously virtually no one else uses it, that says something. This pie chat says it all:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_shar ... b_browsers

Given that Chrome is only 2 years old, it's doing very well indeed. Safari (which has it sown up on Mac) and Opera are significantly older. "Other" includes all the other 20-30+ browsers out there, which is only 1.78%!

[saltysam]

Not keen on Chrome but Firefox is ace.

[Shingster]

What's your line of expertise again Yi? Not IT like myself and Shing I believe.

I'm not trained in nor work in IT so I wouldn't say it's one of my areas of expertise!

[romerojpg]

What's your line of expertise again Yi? Not IT like myself and Shing I believe.

I'm not trained in nor work in IT so I wouldn't say it's one of my areas of expertise!

Nor is Brad, apart from in his own little world

[bradavon]

Fair enough Shing. I thought you did.

I've worked in IT since I was about 18 and have various qualifications in it. I presume that makes me qualified. Eva and Tom are too I think.

[Markgway]

What happened to Eva and Tom btw?

Last I heard Eva settled down with a Sheep (or was it a Hobbit?) and Tom was jailed for headbutting Jehovah's Witnesses.

[romerojpg]

I've worked in IT since I was about 18 and have various qualifications in it. I presume that makes me qualified.

Not doubting your skills you at least some off as knowing your shit on that sort of thing.

But qualifications to me mean nothing at all. I know more than many IT (so called) experts with qualifications, people who work full time in IT. It is so scary thinking about such shit people in IT jobs who frankly all need the sack, I am crap so if I can know more than some of them it tells you a lot haha

[bradavon]

There are courses that numpties can do (my first IT course had a word search as home work ) and many people who work in IT have no qualifications. You cannot get "proper" IT qualifications without knowing your stuff though. I'm no network/windows server expert for example but we're not talking about them.

You use Firefox right Romero?

p.s - Eva no idea. I guess he got bored. The same goes for Tom.

[romerojpg]

You cannot get "proper" IT qualifications without knowing your stuff though. I'm no network/windows server expert for example but we're not talking about them.

You use Firefox right Romero?

Yup Firefox for me always (I hope), I love it.

Mind you I know someone who is an IT expert, he is the go to guy in an entire company, and frankly he is a joke. Yet he has a top job and gets paid loads, and it is scary how little he knows he uses Google when he gets the help calls made me chuckle, still no idea how he got there, he broke his own PC trying to be clever and delete stuff

[bradavon]

Opera 'very satisfied' with browser ballot: Tripling of downloads not to be sniffed at -

http://www.techradar.com/news/internet/ ... lot-676718

"We'd expect Opera to be delighted that it's on the main ballot screen, too – that users don't have to scroll to access it, as they do with less popular browsers such as K-Meleon and Flock. "To remain in that top five is not a foregone conclusion," explains Ford. "Every half a year or so Microsoft reviews the market share numbers and so those top five are changeable."

Come on Yi-long. Get Avant into the "Big 5". You know you want to .

[bradavon]

The bluffer's guide to the 12 browser ballot rivals: Who are the dirty dozen in the ballot and what do they want? -

http://www.techradar.com/news/internet/ ... ide-674043

Have a look what they say about IE and Avant, it's not pretty. It's much kinder on Safari (kind of), Opera, Firefox and Chrome.

The simple fact is the IE engine (called Trident) badly needs a re-write. I never released there were quite so many browsers that used IE's engine at their core, Avant is just one of them. Check out the screen shot of the "Slim Browser". It looks like IE6 and who wants to still be using that? - http://slimbrowser.flashpeak.com/images/snapshot.gif

[gasteropod]

On Chrome:

Amazingly fast development - it's been updated seventeen times since you started reading this sentence

[Markgway]

I tried Firefox. Seemed like a good browser. But I've gone back to Explorer. I guess I'm too used to it after all these years. Pages/fonts/layouts, etc. I realised that as a basic net user there's nothing I need that I.E doesn't give me. I know where everything is and how it works. Maybe if I was just starting out... but unlike you guys I can't find any obvious/major faults with I.E. Don't know if I'll try Chrome at some point. Maybe.

[gasteropod]

I didn't like Firefox when I tried it as an IE user, but I've now been using Chrome for quite some time and it's definitely the best

[bradavon]

Don't know if I'll try Chrome at some point. Maybe.

You should. If nothing else, I guarantee you'll find it noticeably faster browsing the web etc... Which maybe enough to keep you using it. It's faster than Firefox, which is faster than IE. You'll have at least then tried 3 browsers and 2 of the best.

At least you've tried alternatives, which is more than many. As you're coming from the point of view "IE already gives me history, an address bar, bookmarks etc...". I probably wouldn't bother with Opera. They all give you that already.

Remember I said Firefox "out-of-the-box" doesn't immediately look too impressive/too different, I'm not surprised you've come to that conclusion.

[Yi-Long]

Don't know if I'll try Chrome at some point. Maybe.

Remember I said Firefox "out-of-the-box" doesn't immediately look too impressive/too different, I'm not surprised you've come to that conclusion.

... which is why he should have just downloaded Avant. Or the 'firefox-version' of Avant: Orca.

[bradavon]

No, No, No.

Firstly I said "look" too impressive, Firefox easily beats Avant and IE under the hood. I also meant, no offence to Mark but I suspect he didn't use it too long, so didn't discover this. There's a reason why Firefox holds 25% of the market!

Secondly, did you read any of the links I posted? Stop peddling the shite Avant just because you happen to like it. I wouldn't tell a car engineer how to fix my car, so don't tell those in the know to use such a shit browser.

Fair enough you like it but it's wrong to whole heartily recommend software, as being "fantastic" when the evidence points to the contrary and you still claim it's utterly brilliant. Web browsers are so reliant on being standards compliant and secure. Avant is neither of those things.

Avant uses the outdated IE Trident engine which means:

1. Inefficient and slow browsing, in comparison to other modern browsers.
2. Very poor standards support (20% in the ACD3 test), which is holding back web progression and pages may not display correctly (largely at the moment being saved because of IE's usage on the market but this is unlikely to stay the same forever. It used to be 90%, now it's 60%). I quote, from an article today:

"A shift toward open Web standards for Internet Explorer would signal a major change for Microsoft; the company has been criticized in the past for not fully supporting modern, open Web standards. Microsoft's lack of Web standards support is a major factor in the rise of third-party browsers like Firefox, Chrome, and Opera, which feature a more compliant browsing experience, and better support for developers."

Source: http://www.pcworld.com/article/190918/r ... rer_9.html

This problem doesn't just affect Avant but any browser that is technically a front-end for IE. As detailed in the link below, there are many.

As to Avant directly:

"They say: The fastest web browser on Earth!

We say: Oh no it isn't - it's IE with knobs on. While those knobs include online storage, RSS reading, advert and Flash blocking and form autofills, it's still Internet Explorer underneath.

If you've ever wished that Opera ran a different and worse rendering engine with a user interface like the one Safari for Windows used to have before Apple saw sense, then this is the browser for you."

Source: http://www.techradar.com/news/internet/ ... ide-674043

[Yi-Long]

No, No, No.

Firstly I said "look" too impressive, Firefox easily beats Avant and IE under the hood. I also meant, no offence to Mark but I suspect he didn't use it too long, so didn't discover this. There's a reason why Firefox holds 25% of the market!

Secondly, did you read any of the links I posted? Stop peddling the shite Avant just because you happen to like it. I wouldn't tell a car engineer how to fix my car, so don't tell those in the know to use such a shit browser.

Fair enough you like it but it's wrong to whole heartily recommend software, as being "fantastic" when the evidence points to the contrary and you still claim it's utterly brilliant. Web browsers are so reliant on being standards compliant and secure. Avant is neither of those things.

Avant uses the outdated IE Trident engine which means:

1. Inefficient and slow browsing, in comparison to other modern browsers.
2. Very poor standards support (20% in the ACD3 test), which is holding back web progression and pages may not display correctly (largely at the moment being saved because of IE's usage on the market but this is unlikely to stay the same forever. It used to be 90%, now it's 60%). I quote, from an article today:

"A shift toward open Web standards for Internet Explorer would signal a major change for Microsoft; the company has been criticized in the past for not fully supporting modern, open Web standards. Microsoft's lack of Web standards support is a major factor in the rise of third-party browsers like Firefox, Chrome, and Opera, which feature a more compliant browsing experience, and better support for developers."

Source: http://www.pcworld.com/article/190918/r ... rer_9.html

This problem doesn't just affect Avant but any browser that is technically a front-end for IE. As detailed in the link below, there are many.

As to Avant directly:

"They say: The fastest web browser on Earth!

We say: Oh no it isn't - it's IE with knobs on. While those knobs include online storage, RSS reading, advert and Flash blocking and form autofills, it's still Internet Explorer underneath.

If you've ever wished that Opera ran a different and worse rendering engine with a user interface like the one Safari for Windows used to have before Apple saw sense, then this is the browser for you."

Source: http://www.techradar.com/news/internet/ ... ide-674043

Mark said he is perfectly fine with IE, and Avant is a much improved version, so why wouldn't he like it!?

And if you want a firefox browser, why not recommend Orca browser, which has all of avant's benefits, yet puts them over the firefox-engine!?

My browser is more than fast enough. Maybe Chrome or Firefox are marginally faster (maybe not), but at the internet-speeds nowadays, would it be noteworthy? I would rather have a slightly slower browser which has everything you need and does everything you want, out of the box, instead of a browser that's barebones as hell and requires me to download and install all kinds of extra plug-ins and such.

I don't run into problems with websites. Speed is great enough. Regardless of the few links you gave, it's getting very positive reviews, like one of the very first hits on google: http://majorgeeks.com/review.php?id=3 (5 outta 5).

[bradavon]

Mark said he is perfectly fine with IE, and Avant is a much improved version, so why wouldn't he like it!?

That isn't exactly what he said. He said IE was fine for his needs/it does the job. So I doubt he'd have any more interest in Avant, over Firefox or any other browser.

And if you want a firefox browser, why not recommend Orca browser, which has all of avant's benefits, yet puts them over the firefox-engine!?

I've not heard of that one but I wouldn't recommend it. It's likely to be based on an old Firefox version (at least with Avant it uses whatever IE you've happened to have installed, so Windows Update should mean it's the latest) and when a new Firefox comes out, I doubt they update it as quickly.

Besides anything missing from Firefox extensions can add. I'd also rather use a browser made by one of the big 5, simple because they have much more clout in the arena than someone company I've never heard of. It's the same reason I'll probably always be sticking with Windows and MS Office (over OpenOffice).

My browser is more than fast enough.

So's my Ford Focus but it aint no sports car.

Maybe Chrome or Firefox are marginally faster (maybe not)

Firefox is faster than IE but Chrome is noticeably faster yes. It's light and day from IE (which unless they've done something clever means Avant too). I was shocked how much faster Chrome loads web pages and Firefox and IE isn't a disaster either (we all have broadband after all).

Apparently Safari is as fast as Chrome but I hated pretty much everything about it. Opera has a cool feature that compresses pictures (on the fly) for slow connections. I didn't like it as it made pictures (like the Google logo) look really compressed (obviously they were) but it added to general speed increase. They recommend you only need it for slow connections.

but at the internet-speeds nowadays, would it be noteworthy? I would rather have a slightly slower browser which has everything you need and does everything you want, out of the box, instead of a browser that's barebones as hell and requires me to download and install all kinds of extra plug-ins and such.

For the last time Chrome and Firefox (the latter especially) are very much not bare-bones. I've only been recommending you install a solitary extension (adblocking). Firefox has everything (or pretty much everything) Avant has from RSS Reader/Auto-fill of forms (both have been in IE since IE7 incidentally).

I meant, that when you initially open Firefox it may appear that it isn't much different to IE but if you use it, you'll quickly see that isn't the case (25% attests for that). The interface is one thing Mozilla have said needs a refresh. Whereas Chrome "looks" modern and why I said to Mark he should try it. Looking at the review you posted, Avant "looks" just as outdated (I mean the GUI here), so I doubt Mark will favour it an more.

Regardless of the few links you gave, it's getting very positive reviews, like one of the very first hits on google: http://majorgeeks.com/review.php?id=3 (5 outta 5).

The date on that review is 2004!

[bradavon]

IE9 'crazy fast', but rivals still have the speed edge -

http://www.techradar.com/news/internet/ ... dge-677295

This cannot come soon enough. There will always be a large portion who will never move away from it. So at least if Windows Update upgrades their PCs to IE9, they'll get a faster browser.

Going by this early Aplha release Chrome and Safari are still faster but there's finally very little between Chrome, Safari, IE9, Opera and Firefox. It even looks like IE9 could be faster than Firefox 3.6. Check out this graph, it really shows how poor IE8 is (and thus all the browsers that use it as their engine). It's like night and day:

http://ie.microsoft.com/testdrive/bench ... fault.html

p.s - Still poor in Acid 3 though:

http://www.techradar.com/news/internet/ ... r-9-677263

[Markgway]

I'm trying Chrome.....