The Terminator & Terminator 2 HD Releases!

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 25 Jan 2007, 20:50

I never know someone may know:

Terminator:

1. Is Terminator getting an HD-DVD release anywhere?

Terminator 2:

1. Will the French HD-DVD have the Theatrical or Special Edition? Or Both?
2. How do the USA BD and French HD-DVD extras compare?
3. The USA BD will come from the Artistan HD Remaster made a few years ago. This as shown at DVD Beaver looks much better than the old Master used for the Ultimate Edition (ignoring the added fact it came from an HD source for a second).

Will the French HD-DVD look better as it's now HD or will the BD look better as it's now HD BUT also from a Remastered print?

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 25 Jan 2007, 20:50

I had some more questions but the rest have been answered by this DVD Talk T2 BD review:

The disc contains only the film's 137-minute theatrical cut, not the 154-minute Special Edition version that has been released innumerable times on the VHS, laserdisc, and DVD formats since 1993.

The Terminator 2 Blu-ray is encoded in High Definition 1080p format using MPEG2 compression on a single-layer 25 gb disc. The movie's soundtrack is encoded in your choice of Dolby Digital-EX 5.1 or DTS-ES Matrix formats.

The Blu-ray grabs the commentaries off each but unfortunately nothing else.

What a pathetic release of such an important film. It's already obvious the French HD-DVD will knock it for six:

* A choice of DTS-HD Master Audio 5.1 or DTS Hi-Resolution 5.1
* MPEG4 instead of the space hogging MPEG2

And that's without even knowing what cuts or extras are included. It's clear the HD-DVD will look and sound much better. DTS and DD5.1 only one a HD Disc - What?

I really hope the French HD-DVD has the Special Edition as it's my preferred cut.

Full review: http://www.dvdtalk.com/reviews/read.php?ID=22652

As for Terminator BD:

The Terminator Blu-ray is encoded in High Definition 1080p format using MPEG2 compression on a single-layer 25 gb disc.

The problem is that the Blu-ray hardly looks like High Definition at all. In fact, in the majority of scenes it's barely distinguishable from the 2001 DVD edition of the movie. Using MPEG2 compression on a single-layer disc burdened by space-hogging PCM audio takes an obvious toll.

All we get is the obnoxious 5.1 remix prepared in 2001.

I personally prefer the 5.1 remix but otherwise oh dear oh dear.

When HD Disc re-releases come these early BD Discs are bound to be some of the first. Expect to double dip!

Full review: http://www.dvdtalk.com/reviews/read.php?ID=22644

saltysam · Post by **saltysam** » 25 Jan 2007, 21:29

i expect the french release to be the theatrical version.

IronMonkey · Post by **IronMonkey** » 25 Jan 2007, 21:42

This might be a dumb question, but with all the available technology these days, is it too much to ask for them to put all three versions of T2 onto one Blu-Ray?!

I would also like to see a Blu-Ray of The Terminator which features the deleted scenes seamlessly branched into the film as an extended version.

But I doubt anything like that will ever happen.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 26 Jan 2007, 00:14

IronMonkey wrote:This might be a dumb question, but with all the available technology these days, is it too much to ask for them to put all three versions of T2 onto one Blu-Ray?!

Not on a Single Layer MPEG2 PCM Uncompressed BD it's not

but yes with a DL BD and hopefully MPEG4 easily.

Obviously it's deliberate to allow for double dipping.

IronMonkey wrote:I would also like to see a Blu-Ray of The Terminator which features the deleted scenes seamlessly branched into the film as an extended version.

But I doubt anything like that will ever happen.

Me neither. So let me get this straight you're for messing with the film but against messing with the audio?

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 26 Jan 2007, 00:14

saltysam wrote:i expect the french release to be the theatrical version.

Why do you expect that?

IronMonkey · Post by **IronMonkey** » 26 Jan 2007, 10:08

bradavon wrote:
IronMonkey wrote:This might be a dumb question, but with all the available technology these days, is it too much to ask for them to put all three versions of T2 onto one Blu-Ray?!
Not on a Single Layer MPEG2 PCM Uncompressed BD it's not but yes with a DL BD and hopefully MPEG4 easily.

Well I was meaning a properly authored BD - i.e. Dual layer, MPEG4 video and DTS-HD Master Audio.

bradavon wrote:Me neither. So let me get this straight you're for messing with the film but against messing with the audio?

I said a branching version. I obviously meant keeping the original theatrical version on the disc BUT branching in the deleted scenes so you could watch them with the film if wanted. Its always nice to have a choice.

As for the audio, I welcomed the thought of a Dolby Digtital 5.1 mix as long as it was faithful to the original audio master, meaning no changed foley effects!

If the 5.1 track had been a remix of the original audio then I would have been more than happy with it, but they tampered with the sound effects & there are missing music cues.

Anyway, thats just going over old ground. You like the 5.1 on The Terminator, I don't. Simple as that.

EvaUnit02 · Post by **EvaUnit02** » 26 Jan 2007, 12:39

bradavon wrote:
Terminator:

1. Is Terminator getting an HD-DVD release anywhere?

No, as MGM/Sony wholly own the film.

3. The USA BD will come from the Artistan HD Remaster made a few years ago. This as shown at DVD Beaver looks much better than the old Master used for the Ultimate Edition (ignoring the added fact it came from an HD source for a second).

Studio Canal would likely own the HD master used for the R1 Extreme Edition and would've probably utilised it for their HD-DVD. Studio Canal wholly own T2, Lionsgate has just licensed it, just like Momentum/Optimum/whoever now control the UK rights.

Will the French HD-DVD look better as it's now HD or will the BD look better as it's now HD BUT also from a Remastered print?

They're both likely taken from the same master actually, so my guess is that HD-DVD may look better since it'd prolly be on a HD-30 encoded with MPEG4 or VC1. Lionsgate's BD release is on a BD25 encoded with MPEG2. A ~140min film on a single-layer disc encoded with a bloated codec? Surely that'll have a negative impact?

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 07 Jan 2009, 13:37

Terminator 2 Japanese BD Comparison:

http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film/DVDCompare/term2.htm

In short:

* Both Cuts
* Lots of Extras

A proper BD SE. Expensive though. I'll stick with my German HD-DVD.

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 07 Jan 2009, 16:28

Japanese BD seems to be THE ultimate package.

No difference in image quality between it and the Lionsgate though.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 07 Jan 2009, 17:33

Markgway wrote:No difference in image quality between it and the Lionsgate though.

I thought that too but I find it debatable.

The USA BD is very old, single layer, MPEG2 compression. Reports say the UK and French HD-DVD/BDs are better so I seriously doubt the Japanese will be worse.

Based on static captures possibly but I bet the actual discs look loads better. I think the Japanese BD is Region Free too.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 08 Feb 2009, 13:50

New Terminator SE coming:

http://www.theimportforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=16443

IronMonkey · Post by **IronMonkey** » 08 Feb 2009, 14:54

OMG ORIGINAL MONO!

Hopefully with Van Ling on board they will make this a worthy 25th anniversary edition of my favourite film.

I want:

- Original mono.
- Branched deleted scenes.
- All the extras from the DVDs.

Then I'll be happy.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 08 Feb 2009, 15:00

IronMonkey wrote:- Original mono.

Not confirmed, unless I'm mistaken. Fingers crossed.

IronMonkey wrote:- Branched deleted scenes.

It's never going to happen, no offence but move on.

IronMonkey wrote:- All the extras from the DVDs.

Very possible/I'd be surprised if it doesn't happen.

It is good news though, isn't it. The only current BD is a right mess.

IronMonkey · Post by **IronMonkey** » 08 Feb 2009, 15:05

bradavon wrote:Not confirmed, unless I'm mistaken. Fingers crossed.

Someone posted (right under your post) on the Import Forums that Van Ling has stated they will get the audio right this time. I wonder what this person's source is...

bradavon wrote:It's never going to happen, no offence but move on.

Why is it "never going to happen"? It completely possible on BD technology, and don't forget, Van Ling put a lot of work into the T2: Ultimate Edition DVD, which contained 3 cuts of the film. I wouldn't be at all surprised if he had something to do with getting those scenes in there, so its definitely possible that he has a similar idea for the upcoming BD of The Terminator.

In fact, does anyone know a way of contacting Van Ling? I'd like to suggest this to him.

bradavon wrote:Very possible/I'd be surprised if it doesn't happen.

Same here.

bradavon wrote:It is good news though, isn't it. The only current BD is a right mess.

Yeah, it looks no different to the DVD!

romerojpg · Post by **romerojpg** » 08 Feb 2009, 15:32

Mono

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 08 Feb 2009, 15:33

IronMonkey wrote:Someone posted (right under your post) on the Import Forums that Van Ling has stated they will get the audio right this time. I wonder what this person's source is...

My mistake. I missed that. Great!

I wonder if it means they'll be creating a new (no foley) 5.1 remix.

IronMonkey wrote:Why is it "never going to happen"? It completely possible on BD technology, and don't forget, Van Ling put a lot of work into the T2: Ultimate Edition DVD, which contained 3 cuts of the film.

Yes it's technically possible but whether it's ever been considered is another matter. Cameron wanted those T2 cuts but I think he'd be against an alternate Terminator cut (didn't he mention something about it in the commentary), but you never know. It wouldn't really interest me but I'd not be against the idea.

IronMonkey · Post by **IronMonkey** » 08 Feb 2009, 15:35

romerojpg wrote:Mono

Yes, mono. The original mono. I don't want a 5.1 mix with stupid new sound effects and missing music cues!

You might laugh at mono, but the film was made with mono sound, so that is how it should be presented on BD.

IronMonkey · Post by **IronMonkey** » 08 Feb 2009, 15:39

bradavon wrote:I wonder if it means they'll be creating a new (no foley) 5.1 remix.

I could live with that as long as they still include the original mono track. There's really no reason not to include it. But there was no reason to alter the sound effects for the DVD's 5.1 track, and they did that anyway, so who knows what they'll do?

bradavon wrote:Yes it's technically possible but whether it's ever been considered is another matter. Cameron wanted those T2 cuts but I think he'd be against an alternate Terminator cut (didn't he mention something about it in the commentary), but you never know. It wouldn't really interest me but I'd not be against the idea.

I can see your point, but surely if both cuts were included that would please Cameron AND the fans that want to see the scenes integrated into the film?

I happen to think a couple of them are quite important, like Traxler realising Reese is telling the truth in the police station (Lt. Traxler's Arc Part 5), and when Reese talks about not belonging in this time (Sarah Fights Back).

It would just be nice to have the option, and then the 25th Anniversary BD would be the most complete package of the film.

romerojpg · Post by **romerojpg** » 08 Feb 2009, 16:09

IronMonkey wrote:
romerojpg wrote:Mono
Yes, mono. The original mono. I don't want a 5.1 mix with stupid new sound effects and missing music cues!

You might laugh at mono, but the film was made with mono sound, so that is how it should be presented on BD.

Few films are ever presented in what they were made in, its never gonna happen on 99% of all films.

A good quality remix is all that is needed.

Mono is not needed as so few people would bother with it, its a waste of their time and energy spending cash on it, as it aint cheap to add stuff onto any disc.

EvaUnit02 · Post by **EvaUnit02** » 08 Feb 2009, 16:30

Romero watches foreign language animated films dubbed. Goes to show how much of a moron he is.

romerojpg · Post by **romerojpg** » 08 Feb 2009, 16:48

Yeah becuase their mouths soo sinc up with the animation in the origanal language

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 08 Feb 2009, 16:57

IronMonkey wrote:I can see your point, but surely if both cuts were included that would please Cameron AND the fans that want to see the scenes integrated into the film?

Is it a popular request? I've only ever read you want it. Agreed it would be a good idea. I'd still be surprised to see it though. They could've done it years ago, when T2 happened but it never transpired.

romerojpg wrote:Mono is not needed as so few people would bother with it

You're so wrong, there's enough interest to include both.

romerojpg wrote:its a waste of their time and energy spending cash on it

You're what? They already have a Mono track. If they didn't want to spend any money cleaning it up they could just re-use the DVD one. As Warner have for several BDs where Mono is the original soundtrack (like Dog Day Afternoon).

Ironmonkey is right, it makes sense to include 5.1 and Mono. I like the 5.1 remix but both should be included.

romerojpg · Post by **romerojpg** » 08 Feb 2009, 17:04

Obviously you do not know how much it costs to put things onto a Blu Ray, it aint cheap, it has nothing to do with if they have the mono track now in their hands, its the fact they have to pay people to get it on and pay rights etc.. They have budgets for discs to be made, one more audio track may push it over that budget. Hence why they do not bother many times, as its a waste of needed space and budget.

and about 6 people does not count as interest in a Mono track

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 08 Feb 2009, 17:15

I imagine the rights to the Mono track are already secured, along time ago. Otherwise I take your point but you're still wrong about the interest, it's much more than 6 people.

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The Terminator & Terminator 2 HD Releases!

The Terminator & Terminator 2 HD Releases!

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