Martial arts and Fighters

[Heka]

When talking about who's the baddest guy in the world I often hear answers that boggle my mind. Most people seem to think that action and martial arts movie stars are actually good fighters. While I'm sure they might win a fight with a normal person they stand no chance against a trained one, let us say for example high level MMA guy. This thread is dedicated to real life fighters and Martial arts. As for myself I did some Judo when I was a kid but I was too young to understand the martial arts aspect of the sport. Back then I thought of it as a fun way to exercise. Nowadays my eyesight isn't that good anymore and I wear glasses which makes some fighting sports difficult although not impossible.

Here's how I will post on this thread. I will first write about a Martial art, its history and use and then I will provide a few examples of usage and famous users. You guys are free to comment and post your opinions about said sport or fighter. You can also talk about Martial arts and fighting in general.

Today's first lesson is about the world best ground fighting style Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu (BJJ). This martial art was born when a Japanese judoka Mitsuyo Maeda moved to Brazil in the beginning of the 20th century. He taught Judo to Helio and Carlos Gracia who then modified Judo into the BJJ we see today. Many children and grand children of the Gracia brothers still teach BJJ. BJJ has also played a huge part in creating modern MMA (mixed martial arts). The Gracia brothers were one of the first in challenging and competing against people who were trained in other martial arts. Nowadays it's impossible to compete in high level MMA if you don't know the basics of BJJ.

Fabricio Werdum is one of the top MMA heavyweights and his BJJ is at an outstanding level and he has won many prestigious BJJ tournaments.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VBK7LT5A9wo
Here you can see Werdum defeating Fedor Emelianenko who at the time had a record of 31 wins one loss and his only loss was over 10 years ago. Notice how Fedor jumps on Werdum while he's on the ground 1.12 video time. Fedors arms are flailing around too much and against a BJJ black belt they will quickly get snatched as you can see in the video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNQO16ZQ1Fk
Here is the move Werdum used.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJczv8Eq6wM
Here's a American made TV program called Fight quest. This episode is about BJJ.

[HungFist]

You're starting to sound like me, only the topic is different

Looking forward to Kyokushin karate lesson

[Heka]

Looking forward to Kyokushin karate lesson

One Kyokushin karate lesson coming right up. The history of the sport is quite interesting as you very well know. Lets see if I have time and motivation to write about it tomorrow.

[Heka]

Time for another lesson boys and girls. Today we dive into the interesting world of Kyokushin karate. Many of you might not know this but the martial art of karate has divided into innumerous different styles. The origin of karate is believed to in Okinawa where Chinese kung-fu and traditional Okinawan martial arts mixed into the karate we see today. Karate arrived to mainland Japan fairly late, in the 1920s.

But we are interested in maybe the toughest form of karate on the planet called Kyokushin karate. This style of karate was invented by Masutatsu Oyama (Mas Oyama in short) who's life was interesting to say the least. Mas Oyama was born Choi Yeong-eui in Korea but he changed his name for obvious reasons when he moved to Japan. The stories about Oyamas life are so many that it's hard to tell fact apart of fiction. Here a few examples.

Oyama wanted to fly a Kamikaze plane in the second world war and wrote a letter to a high officer with his own blood requesting it. When he was granted this honor the plane malfunctioned and he couldn't get off the ground.

Oyama killed and wrestled bulls with his bare hands.

Oyama spent long periods of time up to 18 months in the mountains training in solitude.

Oyama killed a Japanese occupation force G.I who attacked him with a knife with only one punch.

But enough about Oyama if you want to learn more about the dude try watching some Sonny Chiba movies where Chiba plays Oyama who by the way was his sensei. At first I thought these movies were a bit exaggerated but after reading about Oyama I feel these movies are quite near to the truth.

Kyokushin karate differs from many karate styles because it has full contact sparring and tournaments. In tournaments you can't strike a grounded opponent or punch to the head but everything else is pretty much legal even hard kicks to the head. In Kyokushin training it's very common to harden oneself by doing painful exercises and breaking stuff with ones hands and feet. Padding or protection is never used in Kyokushin karate.

As you can see in the video below the kicks are really sharp and many times come from a quite close distance. The punches are directed to the core of the opponent.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrS2eRl76ik

George St-Pierre is MMA fighter who's also a 3 degree black belt in Kyokushin, he's currently the world welterweight champion. Fucking hate the fact that American faggots put shitty music into most MMA videos. Turn the sound off in the video below and listen to something that you like.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2P2qxCEQ ... re=related

More American faggotry in the form of fight quest. The dialog feels horribly staged but at least you get to see how the fighters train.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZ6OIfWdO9I

Oyamas interview two years before his death.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8vgSsI3-zaI

Lastly my own opinion about this martial art. There are many good techniques that you can learn from this sport (martial art) like the fast kicks from weird angles and hard body punches. You also learn to take a punch and not be afraid of the opponent. One the other hand the movement of these guys seems quite limited they try to dish out as much damage and don't care to block or dodge incoming attacks. This is all fine and good until you face some high level striker who's going to punish you if you don't keep your hands up. You can do all the training you want in the mountains, hell you can even do it under a waterfall and you're still going down if somebody like Shane Carwin catches you with a good punch.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHf5T-ahm5c

[thelostdragon]

My favourite martial artists:
Bruce Lee
Muhammad Ali
Yusuf İsmail aka The Terrible Turk ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yusuf_%C4%B0smail )

[Heka]

I will cover different kung-fu styles and boxing in the near future. I doubt I will cover wrestling because it isn't exactly near and dear to my heart even though it's a were useful sport/martial art to know when battling "enemies", especially on the ground.

Bruce Lee also pioneered many useful fighting techniques and he was one of the first to recognize that fact that to become the best fighter in the world you can't just train in one style. You need to train several styles and you also need to train your strength, agility and stamina.

[HungFist]

More American faggotry in the form of fight quest. The dialog feels horribly staged but at least you get to see how the fighters train.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZ6OIfWdO9I

Nice way to welcome visitors. First break some baseball bats with your bare hands, AND THEN say "now you're ready to train with us" Hope you got good defence.

Pretty much the same as with our Finnish-Iranian tailor... if I recall correctly, he said something in the lines of "these guys break stones with their hands! And I gotta fight them. I'm scared as motherfucker"

(I'm not sure if this is can be viewed abroad, but maybe someone can let us know!)
http://www.jimtv.fi/ohjelmat/kill-arman ... -jakso-9-2

"This must be the first dojo where I see kids being trained at fighting with baseball bat"

[Heka]

Today's topic is Judo. This is the only martial art I've practiced so I have a bit of firsthand knowledge. Judo was owes its roots to jujutsu of which its modified. In 1882 Kanō Jigorō opened the world's first judo dojo in Tokyo. He had cut all the hard to execute techniques out of jujutsu and added some techniques of his own. The idea of judo is that even a small fighter can take down a big opponent if he uses his weight and momentum correctly. Judo has no punches or kicks but it's got innumerous throws and it's also a very good martial art to train grappling.

The type of training one does in judo is very repetitive. I did the sport a few years and all of our training sessions started with physical exercises like taking a fall over and over again. This is done to build muscle memory and it also prevents injuries in sparring situations. We always had sparring against opponents both on our feet and on the ground.

Maybe the world's most know judoka was Masahiko Kimura who fought Brazilian jiu-jitsu creator Helio Gracie and defeated him with Gyaku ude-garami or as we now know the move a Kimura. Today the kimura is very popular also in Brazilian jiu-jitsu. The dude was also in incredible shape and he also trained other martial arts besides judo.

Another great judo guy who all Bruce Lee fans should know is Gene LeBell. He's a judo master who worked as a stuntman in The green hornet and he taught Bruce Lee judo and grappling. He's also famous for defeating a world class boxer using judo. He also caused a bit of controversy using pink gi (judo suit) in a competition in Japan. This was due to a laundry mix-up were they had red shorts washing with his white gi. He won his division using the pink gi and it has become a trademark of he's.

The Kimura
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-hyxTuh2YE

Masahiko Kimura
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkDBflFtPIw
600 push-ups a day huh? I once did 50 push-ups in a row in the Finnish Marines because I had to get my assault rifle back from the lieutenant, here's what happened. I was rolling a camo net into a small "ball" and I laid my assault rifle on the ground to make the task easier. You might not know this but a solider is never supposed to lay down his weapon in a combat situation and my gun got snatched by the officer and he asked me how much the gun is worth. I replied it's priceless but then he said what's it worth in push-ups. Fifty I replied and he said show me. I quickly began performing push-ups and I lost count around 35 but I hoped the officer would say when I've done enough. Sure enough the officer said that will do and gave me my gun back, he also said let that be the last time I see you lay down your weapon.

I was a sapper or as we say in Finland a pioneer in the Finnish costal jaegers hence my avatar. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finnish_Marine_Commandos

Funny LeBell story.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LuqpR7BK ... re=related

Lebell on Bruce Lee.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJoCtd_cblQ

Human Weapon on Judo.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iE7dZK260Tc

[luckystars]

Gene LeBell had a cameo in Rush Hour

[Heka]

He was actually in quite a lot of things.
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0494061/

If you have a few hours to spare try this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2XzP9K-M ... ure=relmfu
That dude is tough. The story at 3min is amazing.

[Heka]

Firstly I want to make a statement why I want you guys to read these posts. I've spotted a major hole in the martial art knowledge of some of the forum viewers/posters and I'm offering to remedy that fact. To me it would be ideal if action movie viewers could see which styles are being used and why the fighters do certain moves. Of course in movies many moves are done just to give the fight some extra panache but it's often quite easy to tell which martial art the actor was trained in. If you never learn these thing you will always just see kicking and punching without any thought in it.

Also I like working out and hopefully these videos will inspire you to get up and exercise because a healthy body is one of the best things to have in life.

[Heka]

I won't run out of martial arts any time soon so here the next installment. Today we explore the interesting world of Muay Thai sometimes called Thai boxing. Muay Thai has decended from the ancient Thai martial art Muay Boran. Muay Thai is the national sport of Thailand where many fighters earn their living using this skill. The martial art has many thing in common with kickboxing but in Muay Thai there is more use of knees and elbows (elbows are forbidden in kickboxing if I remember correctly) and the matches are often quite brutal. The Muay Thai clinch is an essential part of any MMA fighters repertoire. Also the fitness level you have to have in order to compete in this is sport is something everyone should aspire to. There are takedowns in this martial art but there is no ground game.

I don't have any famous practitioners to showcase since Muay Thai has just recently become a worldwide sport and it still mostly practiced in Thailand, at least on a really serious level. But here's a small list of famous MMA guys who use Muay Thai in their training: Anderson Silva, Lyoto Machida, Wanderlei Silva, Mauricio Rua, Thiago Silva, Alistair Overeem and there are of course many more. If you want somebody who's just a Thai Boxer check out Buakaw Por. Pramuk. He's fought professionally 230 times and won 197 times, now that's insane. On top of that the dude isn't that old just 29 but truth be told many Muay Thai fighters can't compete much longer than to the age of 30 because the sport and the fights are very straining on your body.

Here you can see five different moves used in Muay Thai
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcPIJFYmEW4

Here some good old American pop science. I wish that Muay Thai dude would kick that annoying narrator. And the yanks wonder why rest of the world sees them as idiots.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=maQINqPI7S0

Muay thai has also given birth to the flashiest punch of them all, the Superman punch.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-BAGgXj7lRk

Here a superman punch used in a real fight.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01jPJwlsdbs

This time you can choose which dynamic duo you want to watch train Muay Thai. First link Fight Quest made by Discovery channel and the second one is Human Weapon made by the History channel.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WHPYsjbPG18
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JIyWM_MFSl0

And if you all feeling adventures try Kill Arman, this one is clearly the best show since there is no bullshit and the facts about the martial art and the culture are right. Only one slight problem. The show is in Finnish though the good thing is that in Finland we don't dub anything unlike the lesser human beings in the developing world of Western Europe (and almost everywhere else excluding Scandinavia). So all the English dialog is in ENGLISH! Don't know if it will work abroad but give it a try. There are some ads in the beginning.
http://www.jimtv.fi/ohjelmat/kill-arman ... -jakso-5-2

Here's what I think about this sport/Martial art. This martial art is one of the most useful both in terms of self defense and as a sport. The punches and kicks are kept very simple and all the useless crap like breathing exercises have been cut out (Sorry Mas Oyama and Sonny Chiba but I'm calling bullshit on those Karate breathing techniques). Also the use of elbows and knees looks like art to me. Clearly one of the best martial arts to learn striking.

[grim_tales]

My favourite martial artists:
Bruce Lee
Muhammad Ali
Yusuf İsmail aka The Terrible Turk ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yusuf_%C4%B0smail )

What martial arts did Ali do in addition to boxing? I didnt know that

[Heka]

My favourite martial artists:
Bruce Lee
Muhammad Ali
Yusuf İsmail aka The Terrible Turk ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yusuf_%C4%B0smail )

What martial arts did Ali do in addition to boxing? I didnt know that

I think Ali was "just" a really good boxer though he famously fought a wrestler in Tokyo in 1976.
http://prowrestling.about.com/od/thebig ... ivsali.htm
The whole thing was a spectacle and I suspect both fighters just wanted the money not the win.

[gasteropod]

Firstly I want to make a statement why I want you guys to read these posts. I've spotted a major hole in the martial art knowledge of some of the forum viewers/posters and I'm offering to remedy that fact. To me it would be ideal if action movie viewers could see which styles are being used and why the fighters do certain moves.

Jackie uses drunken boxing in Drunken Master II, he does this because he drinks industrial alcohol and everybody knows that that gives you super powers

Also I like working out and hopefully these videos will inspire you to get up and exercise because a healthy body is one of the best things to have in life.

Unfortunately I think this forum is full of ill people lol, I have to drink a can of Monster Energy before being able to just have a bike ride

[Heka]

Jackie uses drunken boxing in Drunken Master II, he does this because he drinks industrial alcohol and everybody knows that that gives you super powers

I think that in the real world it only gives you the illusion that you have superpowers.

Unfortunately I think this forum is full of ill people lol, I have to drink a can of Monster Energy before being able to just have a bike ride

It's never too late. When you exercise enough it becomes a habbit and you don't even think about it.

[gasteropod]

I'm currently awaiting test results to see if I have adrenal insufficiency (the chemical test was horrible). If I finally get treatment, then the exercise shall commence!

[Heka]

I'm currently awaiting test results to see if I have adrenal insufficiency (the chemical test was horrible). If I finally get treatment, then the exercise shall commence!

Hope you get better. I've been healthy all my life so I can't imagine how it would feel to have a chronic condition like that.

[gasteropod]

Thanks, yeah I really hope this will be it, I'm sick to death of being tired and skinny!

[Heka]

The next martial art "article" will be about a form of Kung Fu known as Wing Chun. All you Bruce Lee fan should know this one. I'll try to post it later today.

[Heka]

Today I got a treat for all the kung fu fans on the forum. Today we examine the martial art of Wing Chun. This was the form of kung fu made popular in the west by such greats as Bruce Lee and Ip Man. The history of the martial art is very colorful and it's not easy to distinguish fact from fiction. One story tells that it was invented by a Chinese nun so she could protect herself against bigger and stronger men. Whoever invented it the martial art focuses on speed and agility rather than power.

Wing Chun is quite a difficult martial art to condense to a small article. There are many masters who each teach a different version of the martial art and there are no competitions where one could see with techniques are effective and which aren't. Martial arts that offers competition are superior to ones that don't. That said Wing Chun can be very effective if taught and learned right. The problem is there are a lot of wannabes and shitty teachers who exploit the dumb kids who watch a Bruce Lee movie and think that they can become like him just practicing kung fu.

The most famous Wing Chun practitioner is none other than Bruce Lee. Ironically enough Bruce saw many of the weaknesses of Wing Chun and he founded his own martial art called Jeet Kune Do, which has some of its origins in Wing Chun. You can also see many Wing Chun techniques used in Bruce's movies.

An example of the bullshit that around.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8fxnQGfXiQ
I would like to see that dude block a full power kick (from a trained kicker) with his hand(s). The problem is that a lot of Wing Chun blocks are designed to block Wing Chun punches and kicks. What if you are faced with a TaeKwonDo kick?

A very famous Wing Chun technique, the chain punch.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ClORguy66iA

More Fight Quest
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3X7PDRG79Ls

Strange stance
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOCvng3iEpo

If you a really interested about the history of Wing Chun and Bruce Lee read this.
http://www.lawingchun.com/ikf_bruce_lee.html

Lastly my own opinion. Wing Chun has some good applications but it also has a lot of gaping holes. For example the Wing Chun stance is just ridiculous. Bruce Lee for example abandoned this stance and instead asked Muhammad Ali for footwork tips. Also the kick and punches don't seem to have enough power since the wind up for them is very short. Though this can be a good thing because it lets you strike faster than many opponents. The "illegal" strikes like eye gauges and joint punches/kicks are also taught which are very handy in a real street fight situation. On the ground a pure Wing Chun dude is as helpless as a fish out of water.

[Heka]

There is a big fight tomorrow. A MMA match between two great fighters.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strikeforc ... _Henderson

Fedor Emelianenko vs. Dan Henderson. This is really important fight Fedor because he has lost two of his last fights. His opponent is Dan Henderson who's a lot older but has fought better opponets than Emelianenko.

Fedor.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vn3aQqWkaoA
Practice spar for the press.

Henderson.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M1yBw6jT ... re=related
Interview.

If I had to put money on this fight I'd put it on Hendo. Fedor has a good chance of winning if he catches Dan with a hard overhand but I think Henderson is too smart to engage Fedor recklessly. Also the MMA training in USA is light years ahead of the training in Russian. Fedor has been training in Holland with Ernesto Hoost for this fight so lets see if he has learned any new moves.

[Heka]

This forum is probably the wrong crowd to gather hype over a MMA fight but here it goes. I'm also trying to educate people and hopefully you can learn something from these videos.

Dan Henderson fights.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQUNnurfdaE
Versus Renato Sobral. Notice how Henderson is almost the whole time setting up his right hand. Hendo is just vicious on the ground.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHlkTh_S ... re=related
Versus Rafael Cavalcante. In this one you can clearly see that Hendo used to be a olympic greco-roman wrestler. Awesome balance and takedown defence.

Fedor emelianenko fights.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s6-E06ChOnc
One can clearly see that Fedors base is in Sambo. His stance is a lot lighter than Hendersons and he's very explosive.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DNs99qabr4
This was a freak fight. Fedor defeats Hong Man Choi who isn't that good of a fighter but a very big man.

[Heka]

If I had to put money on this fight I'd put it on Hendo.

Called it!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68C6RYCXUmg

If Fedor wants to keep fighting he'll need to swallow his Russian pride and move to America to train. The days when you are over weight and fight top level guys are over. Fedor was 16 pounds (7,2 kg) heavier but you could clearly see that both in the clinch and on the ground Dan Henderson was much stronger.

[Heka]

A little more info about Dan Henderson and his MMA team, Team Quest.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyAIGt39 ... ure=relmfu

The whole interview.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FeQdr1W3LQk

Damn it would be nice to train at a place like that.