My Impression of Vista

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slasher13
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My Impression of Vista

Post by slasher13 »

For work, I had to test the Vista using Virtual PC, which is running quite happily. I had downloaded Vista Business from MSDN Developer Subscription (Thankfully my work purchases developer licences for all developers), so downloaded 2.5 gig in under 4 hours.

The problem was that in our s/ware, the preview page was no refreshing when a new information was being updated. This was only for people who installed IE7

Here is the mini report I wrote for work:
Tested on XP Service Pack 2 with IE7:
Changed Product description and preview refreshed to show the new
change. 7.0.6 could not do this.

Tested on Microsoft Vista Business with default IE7:
Changed Product description and preview refreshed to show the new
change. 7.0.6 could not do this.

Additional Notes:
Microsoft Vista seems to be a paranoid operating system, Upon
installing 7.0.6 Build, the installer needs to be selected as "Run as
Administrator". When installing the PSPSetup.exe and SSLSetup.exe it
was okay to run, that did'nt need to run, however when first launching
Actinic on the desktop, it again needs to be selected to "Run as
Administrator". If you don't do this, then you will get an error
message saying Actinicextras.js is denied. What happens is that Actinic
cannot create the Site1 folder, and it cannot copy the default site
across, however registry entries are made which is very strange. I was
left to copy the content manually, then everything works fine. I know
we are using digital signs, but will this allow to run Actinic as an
administrator? My fear is that because Vista is so closed, Clients are
going to have the same problem as I did, which results in alot of
support calls.
Upon investigating, looks like we have to digitally sign the executables, so we don't need to run as administrator... and guess what... yes you have to pay for it :(
slasher13
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Post by slasher13 »

Ok adding from what I have written above

To obtain a digital signature and sign all our exes/dlls/ocxs and the installer files. This would mean that the files start without any warning, and the user can see who the publisher is. See:
http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/defau ... wvduac.asp,
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bradavon
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Post by bradavon »

I'm surprised you don't digitally sign anyway, sure it costs but the whole point is extra security. How much does it cost?

What's Vista like otherwise? I'll be getting it early next year.
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Post by slasher13 »

Yeah but it is pretty expensive, our quotes was:

1) Code Signer Pro at US$695 for one year including US$100,000 insurance
against economic loss resulting from the theft, corruption,
impersonation, or loss of use of a certificate.

2) Code Signer Standard including US$50,000 insurance. Certificate is
valid for 1, 2 or 3 years at US$499, US$895, and US$1295

Agreed on the extra security, however I don't like having to sign an executable, just for it to run. Developing application on the windows prior to vista, all you needed for a language capable of compiling to an executable. I just wish code sign could be within the development and not an added extra. Not from a professional point of view, but from a lone coder point of view. My interest are also programming and for myself and many indie developers out there, the prices are pretty expensive just to run your program without any issue, maybe microsoft will help out the indie developer soon

Vista is quite pretty, but it is way too paranoid, even creating a folder, you get two prompts saying.. "Are you sure you want to do this?" Possibily because I was creating a folder in "Programs Files", but still overkill.

However one advantage was that the setup is a breeze and quick, under 1 and a half hours to install Vista Business, that was very very impressive, and it hasn't crashed out that much.. bit slow (poss because it a virtual image), but not unreasonable. Pretty sure PC upto 2 years ago should be able to run this

By the way here is a screeie:

Image
The reason for the darkness was that i had to pause virtual pc to take the screenie, hopefully u should see some things
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bradavon
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Post by bradavon »

Except for Search the Start Menu looks the same as XP. I'm not sure it needs to be there, it's not like I need to search all the time.

Cheers for the comments, yeah agreed that is expensive.

I'm sure I read you can turn off all those extra nagging screens, agreed they can be annoying. Has Explorer finally been upgraded? It's virtually the same since Windows 98 and badly needs a "Skip all" function.

p.s - What on earth is Windows Mail?
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Post by Kurgan »

I think it's the 'new' and rebadged Outlook Express.
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Post by romerojpg »

Most the reviews so far seem posative, but most of them also say wait a while till its patched and fixed. No way I am jumping in for a while yet, hell it looks nice, but bugs and problems wont be solved quickly knowing old Microsoft :D

60000 updates in the 1st month isnt my idea of a working operating system, give them 6 months and I am sure it will be running like silk.
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Post by bradavon »

Compared to what?

I'm willing to bet Linux (if you can pick the right variant) and Mac has as many patches, so does XP (in fact well over it). I'm sure it's stable, it's more secure I know that much (it's based on Windows 2003, XP is 2000).

If you're waiting for the first service pack that won't appear until at least the summer, more likely the autumn. That's a long wait.
Kurgan wrote:I think it's the 'new' and rebadged Outlook Express.
Cheers.

I thought it might be that but what a dumbass name. I've never understood Microsoft's obsession wit renaming products.

I remember their first attempt "Internet Mail" that also had a dumbass name and was pretty rubbish too. Outlook Express is a good name, v6 badly needs updating though.
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Re: My Impression of Vista

Post by EvaUnit02 »

slasher13 wrote:I had downloaded Vista Business from MSDN Developer Subscription (Thankfully my work purchases developer licences for all developers),
Being part of the MSDN is lovely, no? I can get Vista for free as well. Hopefully I'll be able to get it to dual-boot with CrapOS X 10.5.
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Re: My Impression of Vista

Post by slasher13 »

EvaUnit02 wrote:
slasher13 wrote:I had downloaded Vista Business from MSDN Developer Subscription (Thankfully my work purchases developer licences for all developers),
Being part of the MSDN is lovely, no? I can get Vista for free as well. Hopefully I'll be able to get it to dual-boot with CrapOS X 10.5.
Def can't believe what you can download for free on MSDN, basically all developer s/ware that Microsoft have, plus I got a big box of nice cd folder with the MSDN libraries cds plus hard copies of the s/ware. MSDN libraries are the best help files that I have ever seen, it is completely comprehensive.

Def Eva, try out Vista and tell us what you think....
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Post by EvaUnit02 »

Do you use VisualStudio .NET? It absolutely owns.
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Post by bradavon »

I've heard the MSDN libraries are excellent. Can anyone join and how? Don't you have to be a business and/or student???
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Post by slasher13 »

EvaUnit02 wrote:Do you use VisualStudio .NET? It absolutely owns.
Yup for work I use Microsoft Visual Studio .NET 2003. We also a plugin inside VS called Visual Assist X, developed by Whole Tomato http://www.wholetomato.com. It a really good plugin, well worth the money.. :)

Visual Studio 2003, I heard was a bit fast than 2005, most of our developers are still running this. Just getting used to Subversion now... completely different to source offsite (sos). I can see the advantages of it....
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Post by slasher13 »

bradavon wrote:I've heard the MSDN libraries are excellent. Can anyone join and how? Don't you have to be a business and/or student???
It free online, check out http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/default.aspx

All online... offline help files come with msdn subscriber..
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Post by bradavon »

I've registered thanks but how do I get access to the software? It's asking for??? -

Benefit Access Number, Subscriber ID, or MSPP Partner ID
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Post by slasher13 »

No need to register, you would only register if you pay for the msdn subscription to get the s/ware. This is what my company had set for me, Not too sure about Eva thou..

What do you want to check out? Vista?
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Post by bradavon »

So you need to register and I presume pay to get all the lovely software? What do I want?

How about Vista: Home Premium legally for free :D
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Post by slasher13 »

bradavon wrote:So you need to register and I presume pay to get all the lovely software? What do I want?

How about Vista: Home Premium legally for free :D
Yes to the 1st question, however there are different subscription you can get, I got the developer subscription as that my work, however my brother is in networking, so he got that part of the subscription which his work paided for. All subscription I believe get the operating system

Might be an idea to see if you company pays for your subscription, as if you are in networking (or system admin), you can see Microsoft ISA server, SQL server, plus many more. It does work out if you work on these products
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Post by tom2681 »

I've been trying a beta of Vista for a while and I don't like it.
Too heavy, too complicated. The new Start Menu is a joke, too.

I miss Windows 3.11 and MS-DOS :lol:
I used to be "the man who loves the movies you hate".
Now I'm just "that weird french guy with a cat avatar who comes to BnB once a year for no reason and then disappears again".
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Post by Lourdes »

I'm not liking Vista. There are improvements there but there's also more annoying crap. Eventually I'll have to upgrade but by that time there'll hopefully be lots of tweaks and a version of nlite for Vista.
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Post by bradavon »

Thanks Slasher, how much does it cost? Yes work have it but that doesn't help me get a legal copy.

Tom/Lourdes: I'm sure you said the same when XP came out and I'm definitely sure Tom you said the same about the XP Start Menu. Aren't you still using the 95 one?
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Post by Lourdes »

I was perfectly happy with XP. I upgraded as soon as I had a system capable. It was 2K but better ocne you turned a few things off. In Vista you can use the classic theme but there are further nuisances.
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Post by bradavon »

What did you turn off?

I can't believe the 95 start menu/theme is still there. That was designed almost 12 years ago. My god I can't believe people still want to use it.

What's the point getting Vista, if you're going to turn lots of the functionality off?
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Post by Lourdes »

Well if I had a default XP install I'd immediately turn off themes and 90% of the other services, disable WFP and use tweakUI and xpantispy.

What exactly is wrong with the classic theme and start menu? Every theme I've seen is too concerned with appearance over usability. And the classic start menu is almost exactly the same as the new one but more navigable.
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Post by bradavon »

Lourdes wrote:Well if I had a default XP install I'd immediately turn off themes and 90% of the other services, disable WFP and use tweakUI and xpantispy.
Windows Firewall Protection?

I use TweakUI and XP Anti-spy. Agreed they're decent. I've also turned off lots of unwanted services but the XP Start Menu is much better IMO.
Lourdes wrote:What exactly is wrong with the classic theme and start menu?
Nothing except they're outdated (the XP one you can access Quick Programs and My Computer instanly). What's wrong with Windows 2000? Nothing but XP is better.
Lourdes wrote:Every theme I've seen is too concerned with appearance over usability. And the classic start menu is almost exactly the same as the new one but more navigable.
The XP Start Menu not to be confused with the XP Theme (which is just green and blue instead of grey anyway) is more concerned with usability and much easier to navigate.

Sure it's a bit bigger but big deal. I just think it's odd to install XP then go back 12 years.
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